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Here's what we have. When Payton is on the floor we play our worst defense. When Payton is on the bench we play our best defense. http://on.nba.com/2EcJ4SZ But that's not enough. We need more context. Biyombo's defensive rating improves by 9 points when Payton is off the floor http://stats.nba.com/vs/advanced/#!?PlayerID=202687&VsPlayerID=203901 Vucevic's defensive rating improves by 12 points http://stats.nba.com/vs/advanced/#!?PlayerID=202696&VsPlayerID=203901 Speights defense rating improves by 6 points http://stats.nba.com/vs/advanced/#!?PlayerID=201578&VsPlayerID=203901 Gordon's defense improves by almost 8 points http://stats.nba.com/vs/advanced/#!?PlayerID=203932&VsPlayerID=203901 Fournier improves by almost 9 points http://stats.nba.com/vs/advanced/#!?PlayerID=203095&VsPlayerID=203901 And so on. Here's satoransky's numbers with Payton on the court vs off the court http://stats.nba.com/vs/#!?PlayerID=203107&VsPlayerID=203901&Season=2017-18&SeasonType=Regular Season&LastNGames=1 And here's video evidence First basket Payton loses him completely. Second is switched onto speights Third Payton leaves him open in the corner but helping when he shouldn't help. Fourth Payton screws up a box out and gives up a close basket Fifth he loses satoransky in transition by helping when he didn't need to help and completely turning his back to his man 6th probably on Fournier 7th on Fournier 8th Augustin

Who cares about the stats anyway. All you have to do is watch the games and it's obvious that EP is not the starting PG that we need for the future. The modern NBA calls for a PG that is a threat to take and make the open outside shot at a decent percentage. Also a lot of PGs feast on EP.

Hawks just won! TANKTANKTANKTANKTANK

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yaqgecqf Is this what you intended to post? Adding Doncic as our pick? I like it but I will try to add Cleveland as a third team and send Jordan there for some unwanted contracts and their first pick. Heck, we can add Mario to sweet the deal. Something like this: http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=ycupmdrm Remember we are getting Cleveland First round pick. LA gets 2 second rounders from us. We can select Ayton and Doncic/Young/Sexton.

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine Me encantaria ese trade. Beverley,doncic,isaac,gordon y deandre por 1 año al menos jejej no me desagrada ese equipo con dj,ross,simmons,birch saliendo de la banca

I hope so. I hated the idea of watching this same team again at the start of the season, and it make me nauseous to think of watching them for 30+ more games.

Nah not that long. On the strengthen side, takes about a good 2-3 months to see results then there's a slight adjustment time needed to play with new strength.

Not watching this one but looks like paytons getting torched by satoransky. Is it all pick and rolls? I think Payton has been beaten by just about every PG in the league. Skiles probably lit him up in training drills that's why they had a beef.

Why do they have concerns with AG and Isaac together going forward? If they are thinking Isaac will be better suited defensively against 4s because of his superior rim protection and help defense then just play him on the 4s on D, Gordon has shown that he definitely has the ability to guard 3s full time (last season he did great against Melo, Kwahi, some others I can't think of and even Harden for parts). On offense who cares who the '3' is and who the '4' is, they can both definitely co-exist if they are our 2 highest potential players. It's not like we have a great roster where we have a lock with 'x' interior players and 'y' perimeter players and there's only room for one, our roster is garbage and they can just work the other 3 starter roles based on that. I don't see how that is an issue at all, especially how we tried to cater a whole team around someone with significantly less ability and potential.

Someone on realgm posted this. Lol Turner: 'Finding the hot hand!" Fournier was 2-6 before that shot and hadn't made a jumper in about 8 minutes of game time.

Not really. It's pretty simple. The point isn't that everyone else is bad defending the pick and roll. It's that Payton is substantially worse. And he doesn't shoot. He isn't a pariah or a scapegoat. He just kinda sucks.

Valuing Isaac over Gordon doesnt mean you think Isaac is better, it means Isaac will be paid over the next 4 years total what Gordon is about to make in 1.

Greg Popovich could show up on the halftime show and diagram 12 Payton plays where he played terrible defense and Murphy would exclaim that he cherry picked the 12 plays and he's actually a fine defender

AG is a freak athlete with an expanding offensive game who is at best a lockdown defender and at worst a somewhat above average one. To paint him, at 22, as being objectively not worth the max is just ignorant. To do so after we have just watched Oladipo make the leap is insanity.

No let’s just complain a ton without knowing anything.

You wouldn't at least wait to see what the return would be?

There is nothing wrong with that. I am glad to hear that they are not closing any doors. This is the only way you can explore the market and see the value of your players and even if there is a 99% chance they dont trade him at least you are doing your due deligience as the GM. As long as you dont write it on a board

Yeah - Vuc, the REAL reason we’re behind by 20+ points lol!!