Did Otis do right by extending Jameer last off-season?

[Captain Hi-Top 791]

quote:

Originally posted by SmackDaddy:

Something just occured to me that I haven't read here, or thought of previously. If Otis had waited until this off-season to extend Jameer, all 3 of our PG's would be free-agents.

This team would essentially be without a PG on the roster. Is that a good thing or a bad thing?

 

If this were the case, the team would have appx 8 million in cap space to spend on a PG, but would be under the cap and as a result would not have access to the MLE.

 

Hypothetically, that Battie extension looks really, really stupid now. Could you imaginge this team with 14 million worth of cap space?

 

Would we have been able to use that entire 8 million on another player, then resign one of our PG's, albeit, pushing us over the cap, or would we have had to split that 8 million to cover both a PG and back up (one of our own or not).

[Soul Bro 1,422]

Given all of the factors already discussed on this thread, I think it was a decent (right) signing. I was encouraged by Jameer's play in the playoffs when he got starter's minutes, and I believe we would have potentially lost him to Philly this summer had we not re-signed him. Is he slightly overpaid? Perhaps. But the signing gives us (and Dwight) continuity towards the future.

[SharpTony 0]

I guess we have to ask two questions before we can answer this one. First, if we hadn't sign Jameer the extension and he had become a RFA this summer, do you believe we (or any other team in the league) would have given him the same amount of money? Second, now that we have given him the contract, do you believe that any of the teams out there see him and his contract as an opportunity to make a trade? In my opinion, the answer to both questions is NO. Jameer is a good player but we overpaid for him. I don't believe any team will have given him that amount of money or is interested in doing a trade with his contract, no matter how good his playoff performance was. Remember, he had a few injuries during the season where he practically was removed from the roster.

 

Another thing that nobody has brought up is that by giving Jameer an extension, we lost the ability to perform any trades involving him before the deadline. Just before the trade deadline, Jameer and Dooling were injured and this is possibly the reason why our third point guard (Arroyo) was not traded. If we had not signed the extension, Jameer's previous status and contract might have proveen attractive for other teams and we could have gotten the missing pieces we needed in our roster (like a PF).

[The Ghost of John Gabriel 0]

quote:

Originally posted by SmackDaddy:

Hypothetically, that Battie extension looks really, really stupid now. Could you imaginge this team with 14 million worth of cap space?

 

These are the type comments I expect Magic fans to echo for the next 5 seasons thanks to the Shard/Jameer signings.

 

Should be a real common theme in two summers...

[DustinMyselfOff 0]

quote:

Originally posted by CRAZY SERB:

quote:

Originally posted by DustinMyselfOff:

He's not top 5, he's top 15, and that's ok.

 

i'd rather say top 30-35 (and i don't care about stats)

 

anthony carter, chris quinn, mo williams and new york's stephon marbury/nate robinson are the only starting PG's i consider worse than jameer. calderon, lowry, critt, jack, rodriguez and maybe sessions are backups i'd take over nelson.

 

I'd love to disagree with you, but ... in all honesty you're pretty close to right.

[SmackDaddy 30]

quote:

Originally posted by echo4papa:

quote:

Originally posted by SmackDaddy:

Something just occured to me that I haven't read here, or thought of previously. If Otis had waited until this off-season to extend Jameer, all 3 of our PG's would be free-agents.

This team would essentially be without a PG on the roster. Is that a good thing or a bad thing?

 

If this were the case, the team would have appx 8 million in cap space to spend on a PG, but would be under the cap and as a result would not have access to the MLE.

 

Hypothetically, that Battie extension looks really, really stupid now. Could you imaginge this team with 14 million worth of cap space?

 

Would we have been able to use that entire 8 million on another player, then resign one of our PG's, albeit, pushing us over the cap, or would we have had to split that 8 million to cover both a PG and back up (one of our own or not).

 

Well, now that I've had a little more time to consider this, it would be tricky, but...

 

NOw that there are reports that Foyle is opting out, if Jameer hadn't been resigned, the Magic would actually have closer to 10 million in cap space (and 16 million had Battie not been extended - I can't bear to think about that). Most reports I've seen put Maggette's magic number at appx 10 million.

 

Now, unfortunately Otis would be in a very similar situation this year as he was last year with Darko. Explanation: Jameer's cap hold would eat up all the Magic's cap space until he was released. THen the Magic would have 10 million to pursue Maggete or another free agent with. But for the sake of this conversation, let's say the Magic sign Maggette for 10 million. Then the Magic would be without a PG period. They would still have 7 empty roster spots to fill and be without the MLE. I'm also not sure if they would still be able to use the BAE since they started the off-season under the cap.

 

So players under contract would be:

Shard

Dwight

Hedo

Maggette

Battie

Cook

Bogans

Redick

Gortat

 

At this point, the Magic would almost be forced to change their draft strategy. They would also be forced to fill their roster with numerous vet min contracts. And potentially, this would force the Magic to trade Hedo.

 

Do the Magic then look to trade Hedo for Calderon or Ford? Jarret Jack is supposedly available. Would J Will seriously play for the min?

 

We'd also still have our first round pick, and in a draft this deep, I'd like to think that Otis cold nab a 2nd round pick or two to fill a few more roster spots (3rd string PG, 3rd string big man, etc)

 

Whatever the case is, I think I like a core of Maggete, Shard & Dwight better than I do a core with Meer instead of a 10 million dollar free agent.

 

As Miami and Boston have shown recently, NBA teams are changing the way they construct rosters. Having 3 all-star calibre players (and if we kept Hedo we'd have 4), and then filling roster spots with players looking for a ring, seems to be the way to go.

And the Magic outlook would be bright for more than 1-2 years, with players much younger than the likes of KG and Ray Allen anchoring our team.

[KillingInTheNameOf 63]

There are a few missing pieces here imo.

 

If you don't extend Jameer & intend to allow expirings to expire, you do so with intentions, and don't acquire Cook's 3.5m either.

 

Plus you are still armed with Ariza & Redick as trade bait. Young, attractive players in SnT's. Or, you could even just cut them loose if the means justified the ends. Plus, there's always the possibility you could dump the useless Battie in a SnT will others.

 

Lastly, you can either force, or neg under the table with Jameer. Sign him to 1 year deal ala Pietrus. Either give him opportunity to earn extension or work it out at later date! I don't think it's illegal to sign him to one year deal & then sign extension before season even started.

 

Bottom Line, Otis eliminated his options for absolutely no reason. We were never going to do squat with the expirings and we would have at least had a bigger option to explore.

[CRAZY SERB 0]

quote:

Originally posted by SmackDaddy:

quote:

Originally posted by echo4papa:

quote:

Originally posted by SmackDaddy:

Something just occured to me that I haven't read here, or thought of previously. If Otis had waited until this off-season to extend Jameer, all 3 of our PG's would be free-agents.

This team would essentially be without a PG on the roster. Is that a good thing or a bad thing?

 

If this were the case, the team would have appx 8 million in cap space to spend on a PG, but would be under the cap and as a result would not have access to the MLE.

 

Hypothetically, that Battie extension looks really, really stupid now. Could you imaginge this team with 14 million worth of cap space?

 

Would we have been able to use that entire 8 million on another player, then resign one of our PG's, albeit, pushing us over the cap, or would we have had to split that 8 million to cover both a PG and back up (one of our own or not).

 

Well, now that I've had a little more time to consider this, it would be tricky, but...

 

NOw that there are reports that Foyle is opting out, if Jameer hadn't been resigned, the Magic would actually have closer to 10 million in cap space (and 16 million had Battie not been extended - I can't bear to think about that). Most reports I've seen put Maggette's magic number at appx 10 million.

 

Now, unfortunately Otis would be in a very similar situation this year as he was last year with Darko. Explanation: Jameer's cap hold would eat up all the Magic's cap space until he was released. THen the Magic would have 10 million to pursue Maggete or another free agent with. But for the sake of this conversation, let's say the Magic sign Maggette for 10 million. Then the Magic would be without a PG period. They would still have 7 empty roster spots to fill and be without the MLE. I'm also not sure if they would still be able to use the BAE since they started the off-season under the cap.

 

So players under contract would be:

Shard

Dwight

Hedo

Maggette

Battie

Cook

Bogans

Redick

Gortat

 

At this point, the Magic would almost be forced to change their draft strategy. They would also be forced to fill their roster with numerous vet min contracts. And potentially, this would force the Magic to trade Hedo.

 

Do the Magic then look to trade Hedo for Calderon or Ford? Jarret Jack is supposedly available. Would J Will seriously play for the min?

 

We'd also still have our first round pick, and in a draft this deep, I'd like to think that Otis cold nab a 2nd round pick or two to fill a few more roster spots (3rd string PG, 3rd string big man, etc)

 

Whatever the case is, I think I like a core of Maggete, Shard & Dwight better than I do a core with Meer instead of a 10 million dollar free agent.

 

As Miami and Boston have shown recently, NBA teams are changing the way they construct rosters. Having 3 all-star calibre players (and if we kept Hedo we'd have 4), and then filling roster spots with players looking for a ring, seems to be the way to go.

And the Magic outlook would be bright for more than 1-2 years, with players much younger than the likes of KG and Ray Allen anchoring our team.

 

you would give maggette $10mill? and marion, deng, iggy, smith and others could be availabe

 

second, we could have signed meer to the qualifying offer, that would be about 2mill. he would become a unrestricted FA but who cares.

[Voltaire 0]

Now, he will never be John Stockton, Steve Nash, or even Chris Paul. But he could be Tim Hardaway, Tony Parker, or Isaiah Thomas.

 

HAHAHA, that must be the funniest comment i have ever read in this forum. Comparing Jameer to Thomas it's like saying i am as good as the original Voltaire...

[TheRevTy 6]

I was actually talking about style of play, but no matter, bash away.

[ball junkie 277]

quote:

Originally posted by TheRevTy:

I was actually talking about style of play, but no matter, bash away.

 

 

For the record, I agree with you, "Rev".

 

The thing that really sticks out in my mind with Jameer, and I realize he had an up-an-down regular season was that when Toronto was pushing us in game 4 and threatening to even the series(we were down in the 4th quarter) it wasn't Hedo, Rashard or Dwight taking the big shots and or making 10 consecutive points when our season was on the line. It was Mr. Nelson.

 

Could you guys imagine what life would be like in Magic nation or on these boards if the Magic would have lost to the Raptors? Yep, me neither.

[richnba 3]

Nelson is a leader and I think he had a turning point in the playoffs, he played head on against Mr.Big shot taking it straight to him, and if it wasnt for Big shots injury I think the series would have been competive. I think Billups being injured screwed us up to be honest. But if I had toi pick one bright spot in the playoffs, one lone bright spot, it would be the play of jameer nelson.