Howard has moved on, but have Magic fans done so as well?

[barnettej 263]

How many talented players come out to the NBA and do nothing.... Many. Was it because they weren't talented, no... maybe they were in the wrong system like Rip Hamilton in DC. Maybe they were injured out the gate like Oden. Maybe they just didn't put enough into like Kwame.

 

Point is I laugh when people suggest that development is a one way street. Orlando put pieces in place which lead to Dwight taking advantage and becoming the All Star that he is. And I said that both benefited.

 

But the issue is that Dwight as of now has been the only Magic player to "Scheme" his way out, which all evidence suggests was a 2-3yr plan by the chain of events.

 

And if "Wow, your confused" is so insulting.. goodness, then I'm glad your weren't in the Marines with me.

 

And to speak to this:

"If anything, the only legacy Magic fans have right now is that of the jilted fan-base that only shows up to boo it's ex-players and not cheer its current ones."

 

No, there are lots of Magic fans who don't like shady people/players.. This franchise has been through a lot of turmoil and had a lot of great players leave. Too see Dwight leave in the manner he did, and the way he treated his former teammates "playing on a team with nobody's"... Lead to this.. The booing. The not showing up to games is a chalk up to rebuilding.

[Captain Hi-Top 791]

con·de·scend·ing [kon-duh-sen-ding]

adjective

showing or implying a usually patronizing descent from dignity or superiority: They resented the older neighbors' condescending cordiality.

 

If you don't understand how your dismissive one liner response to "Tough Break There" was condescending, and insulting, then I'm glad you weren't in the Marines with me either. This isn't about being offensive to someone, it's about looking like an idiot by acting like the points he made were to insignificant for you to address, like he just "didn't get it", but maybe if he was on your level he would see the errors of his ways. The fact is, he was spot on with a lot of his comments, and it just made you look foolish to come at him that way. Deal with it.

 

Dwight isn't the only player to be part of this franchise that ended up wanting out, and he won't be the last. Heck, you could say that the NBA conspired to get Shaq out of here and to the Lakers, even though Shaq never wanted to be here to begin with.

 

The funny thing is, you're the one who hinted that development was a one way street, no one else. Your own words "Dwight was made by Orlando" removes any impact that Dwight had on his own development. Orlando didn't give him the physical gifts that allowed him to be so dominant, they only did what any other NBA team would have done, work with him to make him a better player. Sometimes it works, some times it doesn't, but, again, it's not like Orlando has some amazing track record of player development that puts them head and shoulders above the rest of the NBA where you could reasonably assume Dwight would never have been as good anywhere else. He was a number one draft pick, after all, and they tend to pan out.

 

Dwight and the Magic made each other better. Dwight was a big piece of a nice stretch of very good Magic basketball. If you wish to let the taste of his departure spoil that for you, so be it, but don't get indignant just because others don't share that same opinion.

[A Better DJ & Photographer 457]

Thank you both for being Marines and serving our country :D

[barnettej 263]

.....

 

Penny

 

TMac

 

Dwight

 

Nick Anderson

 

Dennis Scott

 

Made by Orlando. As in they were given the opportunity to maximize their potential as a player. Penny was injured, so I guess you could argue... But Tmac, was VC shadow before Doc Rivers got a hold of him.. Dwight ..dead horse...

 

Yes, believe or not Orlando has actually developed players here. Shaq didn't add any new tricks when he left, he just had Kobe Bryant which is a better version of penny. And a better system that maximized their players talent.

 

When a franchise doesn't align the talent up with the correct system and coaches you get issues and your player does not grow to his potential. Tracy was a shadow to Vince Cater in Toronto, and should of been in the lineup with Carter instead of in the bench. Tracy leaves them, comes to Orlando where he is now the focal point of the offense, giving him the chance to create his new identity of TMAC.

 

Dwight was the focal point of our offense, giving Dwight the ability to create his identity, leading to endorsements, movies, all star vote leader, etc. But Dwight could not replicate that same success in LA. Why, because Mikes system wants a running center like Amare, to run and gun. Why is Dwight back to producing good numbers ( but not Orlando numbers )... It's because McHale is running the same type of system for Howard that Orlando did.

 

Thanks.

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

What the main point you guys are trying to make?

[Drain-O 369]

Sorry Captain. You know I get carried away with male genetalia adjectives.

[Captain Hi-Top 791]

.....

 

Penny

 

TMac

 

Dwight

 

Nick Anderson

 

Dennis Scott

 

Made by Orlando. As in they were given the opportunity to maximize their potential as a player. Penny was injured, so I guess you could argue... But Tmac, was VC shadow before Doc Rivers got a hold of him.. Dwight ..dead horse...

 

Yes, believe or not Orlando has actually developed players here. Shaq didn't add any new tricks when he left, he just had Kobe Bryant which is a better version of penny. And a better system that maximized their players talent.

 

When a franchise doesn't align the talent up with the correct system and coaches you get issues and your player does not grow to his potential. Tracy was a shadow to Vince Cater in Toronto, and should of been in the lineup with Carter instead of in the bench. Tracy leaves them, comes to Orlando where he is now the focal point of the offense, giving him the chance to create his new identity of TMAC.

 

Dwight was the focal point of our offense, giving Dwight the ability to create his identity, leading to endorsements, movies, all star vote leader, etc. But Dwight could not replicate that same success in LA. Why, because Mikes system wants a running center like Amare, to run and gun. Why is Dwight back to producing good numbers ( but not Orlando numbers )... It's because McHale is running the same type of system for Howard that Orlando did.

 

Thanks.

 

Wow... Your confused.

[The Neighborhood Bully 266]

Wow... Your confused.

 

[barnettej 263]

Wow... Your confused.

 

Oh man I'm so insulted... Let me post my feelings now.

 

Another fun thread down.

[Emory889 353]

.....

 

Penny

 

TMac

 

Dwight

 

Nick Anderson

 

Dennis Scott

 

Made by Orlando. As in they were given the opportunity to maximize their potential as a player. Penny was injured, so I guess you could argue... But Tmac, was VC shadow before Doc Rivers got a hold of him.. Dwight ..dead horse...

 

Yes, believe or not Orlando has actually developed players here. Shaq didn't add any new tricks when he left, he just had Kobe Bryant which is a better version of penny. And a better system that maximized their players talent.

 

When a franchise doesn't align the talent up with the correct system and coaches you get issues and your player does not grow to his potential. Tracy was a shadow to Vince Cater in Toronto, and should of been in the lineup with Carter instead of in the bench. Tracy leaves them, comes to Orlando where he is now the focal point of the offense, giving him the chance to create his new identity of TMAC.

 

Dwight was the focal point of our offense, giving Dwight the ability to create his identity, leading to endorsements, movies, all star vote leader, etc. But Dwight could not replicate that same success in LA. Why, because Mikes system wants a running center like Amare, to run and gun. Why is Dwight back to producing good numbers ( but not Orlando numbers )... It's because McHale is running the same type of system for Howard that Orlando did.

 

Thanks.

 

So, you really believe that those players wouldn't have had similar success if they had been drafted - or signed as a free agent in McGrady's case - by a different team? Dennis Scott would have forgotten how to shoot 3s? Penny wouldn't have been a super athletic 6'7 point guard if he had remained with Golden State? Nick wouldn't have been a valuable roleplayer for 8 to 10 seasons? If you really believe that, you are delusional. There's not even a common connection between those different Magic eras. There isn't a single person that was employed by the Magic for the Shaq era, then the McGrady era, and the Dwight era. The guy that came closest is Brian Hill and if you are giving him the credit for Dwight and Shaq developing, then you are whatever the next worse thing is from delusional. So who developed them? Disney employees?

 

Also, to debunk a couple of your theories.....the reason Dwight didn't put up the numbers in LA that he did in Orlando was because his back was jacked. Have you ever tried to do anything with a bad back? You wouldn't do well at it. Shaq went from a player that the Chicago Bulls, and primarily Dennis Rodman, shut down guarding him one on one to a player that was the most dominant player in the NBA. He clearly improved from his time in Orlando. Also, if you are going to suggest that he received better coaching in LA - which he obviously did - then you also have to come to the conclusion that LA did more to develop him than Orlando did. Who would you rather have develop a young center: Phil Jackson or Brian Hill? Then again, it appears your idea of developing talent is to let them come in and simply be the focal point of the offense. By that logic, the 76ers are currently developing Michael Carter Williams.

[Captain Hi-Top 791]

Oh man I'm so insulted... Let me post my feelings now.

 

Another fun thread down.

 

I'm only going to say this one more time, and I'm not going to mix any basketball talk into the post, because, for some reason, you don't seem to get the point even when I spell it out.

 

It isn't about feelings. It isn't about insulting another poster. If it were, I would have simply taken care of the situation as a mod.

 

It's about being dismissive of someone's points and acting like they have no merit because you disagree and don't want to respond and carry out a discussion about the topic at hand.

 

If you have anything else to say on the matter, send me a PM.

[Tough Break There 96]

So, you really believe that those players wouldn't have had similar success if they had been drafted - or signed as a free agent in McGrady's case - by a different team? Dennis Scott would have forgotten how to shoot 3s? Penny wouldn't have been a super athletic 6'7 point guard if he had remained with Golden State? Nick wouldn't have been a valuable roleplayer for 8 to 10 seasons? If you really believe that, you are delusional. There's not even a common connection between those different Magic eras. There isn't a single person that was employed by the Magic for the Shaq era, then the McGrady era, and the Dwight era. The guy that came closest is Brian Hill and if you are giving him the credit for Dwight and Shaq developing, then you are whatever the next worse thing is from delusional. So who developed them? Disney employees?

 

Also, to debunk a couple of your theories.....the reason Dwight didn't put up the numbers in LA that he did in Orlando was because his back was jacked. Have you ever tried to do anything with a bad back? You wouldn't do well at it. Shaq went from a player that the Chicago Bulls, and primarily Dennis Rodman, shut down guarding him one on one to a player that was the most dominant player in the NBA. He clearly improved from his time in Orlando. Also, if you are going to suggest that he received better coaching in LA - which he obviously did - then you also have to come to the conclusion that LA did more to develop him than Orlando did. Who would you rather have develop a young center: Phil Jackson or Brian Hill? Then again, it appears your idea of developing talent is to let them come in and simply be the focal point of the offense. By that logic, the 76ers are currently developing Michael Carter Williams.

 

 

Agreed.

 

I think this thread has cleared up much confusion. Good lively discussion. And I appreciate you sticking up for me Captain.

 

In regards to Dwight/ex-Magic players, I just think it comes down to different ways of viewing the world. How things end, to me, doesn't alter the good times in the past.