Howard needs help (Ken Berger, CBS Sports)

[Trey Time 186]

As if this needs to be stressed any more...

 

It was one **** game. The Miami game was practically a mirror image of last season's blowout home loss against the Cavs. Mo and LeBron shot an unconscious percentage from the perimeter, the Magic shot horrendously from three-point range, etc etc. We also got clowned by the Thunder in OKC. Our starters shot a cumulative 34% from the field, we had no answer for a premier perimeter threat (Durant), and so forth. Following the game, our effort, depth and potential to contend were all undoubtedly questioned.

 

As the season progressed, we proved we could compete and ultimately, beat those teams. Why is the Miami game any different? Why is it that some on here feel compelled to attach so much meaning to a game that is otherwise a carbon copy of the quintessential blowout victory?

 

Newsflash: when we shoot poorly from the perimeter, we're more than likely to lose the game. In the past, this was largely a product of teams not having to double team Dwight. That proved not to be the case against Miami. Players, and to a greater extent shooters, have off nights regularly. This was blatantly evident upon viewing Redick miss the rim on a transition three, and watching Shard brick two wide open looks on back-to-back possessions. We lost the game, but isn't it possible that the given circumstances (couldn't hit water if we fell out of a boat) exacerbated the situation? Do some of you truly believe Miami is 20-25 points better than us? If not, then why can't we simply acknowledge that this is the NBA, and any team is capable of being blown out on any given night?

 

More importantly, it's game 2 of 82, and if some here still feel that this team needs to undergo a significant change, then you are all deprived of basic reasoning, and merit no more acknowledgment as far as I'm concerned.

 

This is basically what I've been trying to tell people. We would've lost to Minnesota that night if we shot like that. Now, if our starters shoot 45-50% and we lose to the Heat by 26, then you can make all the panic threads you want.

[Emory889 353]

Stan did not "rip" the team Soul bro. He merely acknowledged that the Magic sometimes struggle when they are forced to create individually from the perimeter. He went on to say that this could be combatted with good ball movement around the perimeter. He didn't say anything about this team not being able to compete or making roster changes. Those are the words of Ken Berger and your former basketball coach.

 

This thread and a couple of other active threads are the equivelant of knocking down a house because the interior needs a paint job. Calling for changes 2 games into a season is absurd...and a basketball coach on any level should know that.

[KillingInTheNameOf 63]

The idea Orlando needs a better play maker on the perimeter to compliment Dwight is nothing new, but it's not like other teams are itching to accomodate Orlando's need, and there are probably less than 15 players in the entire league who could fill that role.

 

Hedo was marginal at the elite level in that role & re-signing him wasn't an option. Otiz put a band aid on the situation with VC and the results haven't even lived up to those expections, let alone the expectations of those who thought he was THE SOLUTION. The relevent question however to ask here is, was VC the best option to attempt to fill this role at the time? Answer, most likely. So, what's a GM to do?

 

Otiz has assembled a deep roster of players other teams covet and he's poised to make a move if the right opportunity presents itself. The question I have is, will Otiz move his guys (Shard & Jameer) if necessary to make it happen? Only time will tell, but I imagine Otiz is at least more open to the idea today than at any point prior.

 

The other question I have, would SVG accomodate a different type of roster upgrade if it was the best option for Orlando to improve? At the risk of examining theoretical acquisitions, I can't help but wonder if Orlando could have made a play for Amare Stoudemire. Especially when you see Pheonix replace him with Hedo Turkoglu. Given Amare's ties to O-town, the fact Shard would almost certainly be viewed by Pheonix as a much better replacement than the combo of Hedo & Hak, and they'd have virtually the same amont of money committed to Shard as the Hedo/Hak combo...this could have been a squandered opportunity to kill two birds with one stone and create the most dominate front court in the league. One that wasn't even explored.

 

I think the goal has to be improvement, not necessarily improvement within a box that SVG has built. Example, Amare. Theoretically, such a player wouldn't fill the need. But, tell me Miami or Boston is going to let Amare work one on one w/o doubling.

 

I also think what gets lost in all the analysis of Orlando's limitations vs. elite teams is defense because the disappearing 3 pointers are more obvious. There's a flip side to this problem and it's that Orlando's perimeter D gets broken down more often by these elite teams. Orlando's defensive success is all Dwight Howard. You surround Dwight with good defensive players, give him a front court partner, and Orlando would be the team suffocating elite teams defensively. LA, Boston, Miami, and Detroit before them didn't beat Orlando with offense, so why is Orlando looking to offense to get over the hump vs. them? I can't be convinced the easiest and most effective changes Orlando could make vs. contenders would be to improve as a defensive team. I'm aware of their statistical success over the past two seasons defensively, but to focus soley on the inability of their perimeter players to break down elite defenses is only half the problem and Dwight Howard as an anchor defensively is the foundation of this team's success, not 3 point shooting. Which I would build upon, is a no brainer. Otiz's theory that you build a team by getting good offensive players to play their best D is not one I subscribe to.

[Secretly Space Jesus 670]

This is true , there was a thread with some links to this.

 

No, it isn't.

 

Every article stating that such a wishlist existed was either written by Berger or was quoting something written by Berger. Every damn one of them.

 

There's been no evidence to suggest Dwight made a wishlist or asked for Otis to trade for people, beyond like, one article where he was asked if he'd like to have Carlos Boozer as a teammate and he said something like: "Yes, he's a great player."

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

The idea Orlando needs a better play maker on the perimeter to compliment Dwight is nothing new, but it's not like other teams are itching to accomodate Orlando's need, and there are probably less than 15 players in the entire league who could fill that role.

 

Hedo was marginal at the elite level in that role & re-signing him wasn't an option. Otiz put a band aid on the situation with VC and the results haven't even lived up to those expections, let alone the expectations of those who thought he was THE SOLUTION. The relevent question however to ask here is, was VC the best option to attempt to fill this role at the time? Answer, most likely. So, what's a GM to do?

 

Otiz has assembled a deep roster of players other teams covet and he's poised to make a move if the right opportunity presents itself. The question I have is, will Otiz move his guys (Shard & Jameer) if necessary to make it happen? Only time will tell, but I imagine Otiz is at least more open to the idea today than at any point prior.

 

The other question I have, would SVG accomodate a different type of roster upgrade if it was the best option for Orlando to improve? At the risk of examining theoretical acquisitions, I can't help but wonder if Orlando could have made a play for Amare Stoudemire. Especially when you see Pheonix replace him with Hedo Turkoglu. Given Amare's ties to O-town, the fact Shard would almost certainly be viewed by Pheonix as a much better replacement than the combo of Hedo & Hak, and they'd have virtually the same amont of money committed to Shard as the Hedo/Hak combo...this could have been a squandered opportunity to kill two birds with one stone and create the most dominate front court in the league. One that wasn't even explored.

 

I think the goal has to be improvement, not necessarily improvement within a box that SVG has built. Example, Amare. Theoretically, such a player wouldn't fill the need. But, tell me Miami or Boston is going to let Amare work one on one w/o doubling.

 

I also think what gets lost in all the analysis of Orlando's limitations vs. elite teams is defense because the disappearing 3 pointers are more obvious. There's a flip side to this problem and it's that Orlando's perimeter D gets broken down more often off iso's by these elite teams. Orlando's defensive success is all Dwight Howard. You surround Dwight with good defensive players, give him a front court partner, and Orlando would be the team suffocating teams defensively. LA, Boston, Miami, and Detroit before them didn't beat Orlando with offense, so why is Orlando looking to offense to get over the hump vs. them? I can't be convinced the easiest and most effective changes Orlando could make would be to improve as a defensive team. I'm aware of their statistical success over the past two seasons defensively, but to focus soley on the inability of their perimeter players to break down defenses is only half the problem and Dwight Howard as an anchor defensively is the foundation of this team's success, not 3 point shooting. Which I would build upon, is a no brainer. Otiz's theory that you build a team by getting good offensive players to play their best D is not one I subscribe to.

 

I think one of the keys to success is diversity. I dont think Amar'e would bring enough of that to put orlando "over the top".

 

I like the defensive Idea though. I think one of the reasons to our success in 07 wasn't so much our offense as it was lee/pietrus/others in limited capacity playing defense at a significant level greater than what they play now.

[Give Me Redick All Day 109]

At a certain point though, and please don't mistake this for "panic," isn't the philosophy of surrounding a tank with a bunch of machine gunners (can't remember who said this first; Soul Bro maybe?) a little overdone? We didn't beat LA in the Finals, we didn't beat Boston last year, and this year the competition has stiffened in our own division. Yes, we maintained a regular season record of 59 wins, and played lights out, historic bball the second half of last year, but the result was still the same: no ring.

 

I like the idea of surrounding Dwight with shooters, but at some point denial becomes redundant, and we need to accept the fact that a compromise is in order. Granted, if a deal can't be done because we don't have the money or assets, well tough titties... but something DOES need to be altered, because I believe we'll keep hitting the same wall over and over again until a major change happens, either good or bad.

 

But whatever, I'm just spinning my wheels here. My best contributions consist of wanna-be witty one-liners that aren't funny, and obscure references to screenplays I've written, that no one gets.

 

Carry on.

[BMP 424]

It's more of a personnel problem than a system problem.

[FENDI 4]

We never should have let Milicic go!

:o

[Captain Hi-Top 791]

Like Stan said, none of the guys on our team are guys that can create their own shot against a great defense. We have to overcome that with smarter passing. How many guys in this league ARE great at creating their own shot against an effective defense? Not too many, and just because one guy may be available, doesn't mean he is available to us. Stan wasn't blasting the team, he was pointing out what they need to work on.

 

"I mean, we don't have [Dwyane] Wade and [LeBron] James and Paul Pierce and Kobe Bryant. And so for us to play well offensively, we have to get great ball movement. We really have to execute and move the ball. And yeah, we struggled to do that against a very good team in Boston and we struggled to do that again tonight."

 

Sorry Ken, sorry Junkie, but that's NOT the same thing as saying "We don't have the personnel to get it done", Dwight needs help, but there is no reason that help can't come from his current team.

 

Friday night was a great example of how much shooting will play into the matchups between our team and Miami. Either one of these two teams get hot, the other team is in trouble. Period. Especially if they are shooting poorly from the field. I thought we did a great job of protecting the rim, and keeping LeBron and Wade from easy points in their half court sets, forcing them into mostly jumpers. They both got hot, and that's going to happen sometimes, but the important thing here, from the defensive side, is that we did a decent job of forcing them into jumpers. The draw back, and adjustment Orlando needs to make when this happens, is in the rebounding department. Forcing them into a jump shooting team leads to long rebounds, and Dwight needs help when that happens.

 

It's early in the season. There is more than enough time to keep working on things to account for these situations. Enough time even to work on them, see how well it works, and if it isn't headed in the right direction, make a move by the trade deadline if the proper opportunity presents itself.

[Soul Bro 1,423]

"Passing's a major problem with our team, it really is," Van Gundy said. " ... Look, their defense was very good. But I think when the defense is good, that's when our passing problems become evident."

Then Van Gundy used the word "horrendous" to describe it.

 

Guys, this is ripping, right? Please note, I'm not saying SVG is explicitly saying we need a change. KITNO, as almost always, good stuff. And to the rest of you, I actually think some adjustments can/should be made against the elite teams. For instance, unless Jameer has lost significant ability, which I don't believe is the case, he needs to attack the paint more, if just to kick it over or out. Nash is a master at this style of play. However, if we can upgrade this team by moving VC or other pieces, I personally would like to see it done and imagine Dwight would like it, too. And, no, Arenas does not qualify, imo.

 

Hedo, whether or not Dwight had a list, Otis was obsessed with getting Paul over the summer. This comes from one of his closest "people." By the way, where in the world is Rev Ty??? Dude, we miss you.

 

And Echo, Junkie was my "Y" coach about 25 years ago, just to give you an indication of his age and my age (mid-thirties). Makes me laugh just to think of those days.

 

In the spirit of some of our foreign brothers, go Magics!

[Captain Hi-Top 791]

And Echo, Junkie was my "Y" coach about 25 years ago, just to give you an indication of his age and my age (mid-thirties). Makes me laugh just to think of those days.

 

Soul... this is like the second or third time you've given indication of your age (and Junkie as well) to me for some reason. I know how dreadfully old you are. I only say dreadfully as a joke, and only then because I'm 36 myself. Ouch. 36? When the Marc Jackson (Haha DoM) did that happen?

[Soul Bro 1,423]

Soul... this is like the second or third time you've given indication of your age (and Junkie as well) to me for some reason. I know how dreadfully old you are. I only say dreadfully as a joke, and only then because I'm 36 myself. Ouch. 36? When the Marc Jackson (Haha DoM) did that happen?

 

 

It's all good, old man