2016-2017 Season Discussion Thread

[MagicFanInNevada 51]

I mostly agree. But point guard is definitely an issue.

 

I agree, I'd be happy with Brandon Knight or even Rodney Stuckey at this point

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

I agree, I'd be happy with Brandon Knight or even Rodney Stuckey at this point

 

No.

[Murphy13 185]

I agree, I'd be happy with Brandon Knight or even Rodney Stuckey at this point

 

As opposed to whom? Stuckey would be a nice backup but might be in decline and offers less offense than our current similar option in Augustin. Knight isn't that good at pg or defense and is a worse shooter than Payton overall despite being marginally better at threes.

[Jay Magic 1,251]

Orlando has lost 13 straight games to Washington when John Wall has played. Let's break that tonight if possible

[barnettej 263]

Pshhh next your gonna say Kyle o Quinn is as good or better than biyombo -- oh wait you already said that. Your comparisons are absurd.

 

Dedmon can barely stay on the court. Stop with that.

 

i don't see how anyone can complain about him when we're the #1 defense right now. Just for that he's worth every penny because that will not only win us games, but it will also keep us in games when we're shooting poorly.

 

Right now our problem is the SF and PG positions and the scoring coming from those positions. That's about it.

 

You tell me.......

 

Biyombo PER - 10.04

Quinn PER - 18.86

Dedmon PER - 17.95

 

Now you can say that is because Biyombo has higher usage, but then the counter argument is then the stats should be doubled for Dedmon and Quinn becuase of their lower usage.

 

Up to who ever how they want to look at it. For me I just see duplication for something we could of achieved at a lower rate.

 

Defense is a two part system in a way. If you can run up the score on people then that changes the tactic of the team, making them go for more 3's than 2's. But if you cannot run up the score, then that also changes the tactics as well, more 2's and paint shots than 3's more about possessions.

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

You tell me.......

 

Biyombo PER - 10.04

Quinn PER - 18.86

Dedmon PER - 17.95

 

Now you can say that is because Biyombo has higher usage, but then the counter argument is then the stats should be doubled for Dedmon and Quinn becuase of their lower usage.

 

Up to who ever how they want to look at it. For me I just see duplication for something we could of achieved at a lower rate.

 

Defense is a two part system in a way. If you can run up the score on people then that changes the tactic of the team, making them go for more 3's than 2's. But if you cannot run up the score, then that also changes the tactics as well, more 2's and paint shots than 3's more about possessions.

 

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&hint=Bismack+Biyombo&player_id1_select=Bismack+Biyombo&y1=2017&player_id1=biyombi01&hint=Kyle+O%27Quinn&player_id2_select=Kyle+O%27Quinn&y2=2017&player_id2=oquinky01&hint=Dewayne+Dedmon&player_id3_select=Dewayne+Dedmon&y3=2017&player_id3=dedmode01

 

PER isn't a catch all stat for "good"

 

biyombo has a lower usage.

 

Dedmon and O'Quinn are 13mpg players. they are efficient/above average 13 mpg players. If we needed a 13 mpg player then a cheap option like Dedmon or O'Quinn would make sense.

 

Biyombo is a 26 mpg player. Dedmon and O'Quinn cant be 26 mpg players at their current production because they'd either live a constant life of foul trouble (fouls per 100 possessions- biyombo 5.2, dedmon 8.6, O'Quinn 7.6) or they'd have to amend their play for their roles (i.e. Dedmon couldn't run around like a lunatic trying to block every shot that comes into the paint).

 

 

so again, if we needed a 13mpg player, of course we would be better off with those guys at a cheap price. however, Biyombo is starting. that's a huge difference.

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

People need to understand there's no way to take a stat and use it as a definitive measure of a player's worth.

 

PER is just a measurement of the amount of stuff a player does in a given role. You take that and the teams offensive/defensive numbers when the player's on the court, the teams offensive/defensive numbers when that player is on the bench, and true shooting percentage, and win shares, and win shares per 48, and BPM and VORP and then you just watch a lot of basketball games and when you put that all together you can say "hey, maybe this guy is better than that guy based on ______"

[MagicFanInNevada 51]

Orlando has lost 13 straight games to Washington when John Wall has played. Let's break that tonight if possible

 

Yes please

[The Neighborhood Bully 266]

Last season, in lineups that played 80 minutes or more, there was only one lineup featuring Oladipo with a positive net rating. The reasons for this were sporadic with some being a drop in defense, offense, or just a complete and total disaster across the board. There was one consistency across them all, however, which was the Magic were an improved team when these lineups didn’t have Oladipo. But when looking at Oladipo’s individual on/off numbers, he appears to have improved the team as a whole.

 

This is telling that Oladipo was a good player in a bad fit. There were always flashes of what could have been throughout his tenure in Orlando, but Oladipo was never able to put it together and the Magic ended up deciding to trade him on draft night for Serge Ibaka.

 

It turns out maybe the Magic should have kept Oladipo for one more year, or perhaps he just needed a change of scenery because the jump everybody has been waiting for may finally be happening. He’s not quite the superstar player Orlando was hoping for, but the most noticeable improvements of his career are beginning to show on a nightly basis. No longer tasked with carrying an entire offense, Oladipo is able to focus less on creating and more on taking advantage of a defense focused elsewhere. He’s still shooting just as many times this season as he was in Orlando, but there’s more of a purpose to it. It doesn’t feel like pointless chucking anymore.

 

His shot selection has definitely changed for the better thanks to the spacing Billy Donovan’s offense has created. Mid-range attempts have been redistributed to 3-point shooting, and the amount of attempts he’s taken from deep this season is almost half last season’s total. None of this would matter if Oladipo’s shots weren’t falling, but right now he’s shooting a career-high 38 percent from 3-point range.

 

 

 

 

The biggest weakness of Oladipo’s game in Orlando was always his 3-point shooting. He could never become enough of a threat from distance to force defenses to adjust, and his role was so heavily focused on having the ball in his hands that he found himself mainly shooting from inside the arc. Now, with Russell Westbrook sucking up much of the attention, Oladipo is able to attack defenses in different ways. He rarely shot corner 3s in Orlando, but he’s basically automatic from there with the Oklahoma City Thunder.

http://fansided.com/...agic-westbrook/

[TheNameIsOrlando 310]

We all said for years Oladipo wpuld excell once the pressure was off of him. He was stuck playing over his head.

 

Same goes for Fournier.

 

Hopefully we can soon get into a position as to not have to rely on guys that are not capable of what we are asking them.

 

Im very happy for Dipo. He was my favorite Magic of recent years.

[Odin 137]

We all said for years Oladipo would excel once the pressure was off of him. He was stuck playing over his head.

 

Same goes for Fournier.

 

Hopefully we can soon get into a position as to not have to rely on guys that are not capable of what we are asking them.

 

Im very happy for Dipo. He was my favorite Magic of recent years.

 

Unless Oladipo does something really stupid, I will continue rooting for him wherever he goes.

[Franchero MVP 391]

[/size]http://fansided.com/...agic-westbrook/

 

This article made me lol

 

Oladipo struggled to fit in on the roster the Magic had put together — a severe lack of shooting left him without spacing and the coaches he worked with usually tasked him with creating a large majority of the offense.

 

This is telling that Oladipo was a good player in a bad fit.

 

Then...

 

It turns out maybe the Magic should have kept Oladipo for one more year

 

Huh? What would have changed? Oh, are we sure that isn't because he's now playing next to HOFer RWB?

 

 

No longer tasked with carrying an entire offense, Oladipo is able to focus less on creating and more on taking advantage of a defense focused elsewhere.

 

Oh right, we don't have a guy like that. So, no, we shouldn't have kept him. Trading for fit in Ibaka is allowing our defense to be insanely good and Ibaka is straight killing it for us, Millsap style.

 

I'm all for dipo and I am glad he's doing well, but lets not pretend he would have improved just as much over here.