JJZFL 619 Report post Posted June 23, 2017 Teams don't just magically trade back because you want to trade up. If our terrible team doesn't want Watson why would someone else? I'm not sure why everyone believes you can shape your roster with second round draft picks. The majority of contender's benches are built through trades and free agency. We've been trying to do that these past few years and look at our bench. Our current backup point guard is Augustine. Would it really have been so terrible to take a chance on one of the somewhat highly rated point guards still available with the 25th or 33rd pick? You're earlier point about not drafting a late first rounder you think might not turn out needs to be put in context. A comment like that makes far more sense for a San Antonio or Golden State than it does for us. Look at our bench. Is there no one we could have drafted at 25 with more potential to help us than Augustine or Rudez, for example? And you're missing the point P4TW was making about Watson. He was suggesting that since no one would want to take Watson off our hands for the reasons you mention, you incentivize them to do so with a draft pick that they want, and thereby get some value in return instead of just giving the picks away for equivalent or worse picks in some future draft. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tank Vogel 191 Report post Posted June 23, 2017 Can't say management's behavior at the end of the 1st round inspired any confidence, guess we're gunning for Luka Doncic next year. I see Isaac's best case as Rashard Lewis with elite defense. That is a steal at 6 if he reaches it. I'd say his mid is Tayshaun Prince with more rebounds/blocks. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Justin Jaudon 221 Report post Posted June 23, 2017 Late first rounders are never given that much value, even in this draft. Why draft a guy you don't think will turn out to a guaranteed 3 year deal? A lot of people argue that an early second rounder is a lot more valuable than a first because it's not guaranteed. Again, your making a ridiculous argument about what we did late in the draft where players rarely have long term potential because you don't like what we did at #6. Yea, late first rounders never have much value. Rondo was not valuable. Kyle Lowry: almost useless, may as well give that pick away. Tony Parker sure didn't turn into much. David Lee hasn't done anything with his career. Jimmy Butler really wasn't worth that massive rookie contract. If Hammond can't find a guy he thinks has a solid chance of becoming a good rotation player in this draft at 25, he shouldn't be an NBA GM. He probably shouldn't even be talking about basketball on-line with grownups. I'm not making a ridiculous argument; and certainly my frustration with trading 25 and 35 for worse picks later has nothing to do with what we did at #6. I fully expected us to take Isaac. I'm not happy with that pick, but I'm glad it wasn't Lauri Markanan. We should have used 25 and 35 to move up, not just throw them away. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Magicman28 295 Report post Posted June 23, 2017 That is a steal at 6 I was about to say, that's pretty damn good. People forget how good Lewis was in Seattle. He came here and his role completely changed but in Seattle he was a pretty damn good scorer. You add shot blocking, defense and rebounding to that... I think Isaac has better ball skills though. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fultz4thewin 2,464 Report post Posted June 23, 2017 Teams don't just magically trade back because you want to trade up. If our terrible team doesn't want Watson why would someone else? I'm not sure why everyone believes you can shape your roster with second round draft picks. The majority of contender's benches are built through trades and free agency. 1. because the value is there. philly traded a 2020 heavily protected first to trade in to 25. really early second rounders are incredibly valuable because the difference in talent isn't that high but they also don't attach guaranteed money. 2. other teams wouldn't want Watson. but an early second round pick has more value to someone like Brooklyn than the 1 million in cap space that waving him would leave them. 3. you can't shape your roster with second round picks. but you do find valuable rotation players from time to time. with two way contracts being available now you can take your time developing guys without wasting roster spots. 4. Malcolm Brogdon, rotation player for a playoff team. picked 36 last year. Patrick McCaw, made big plays in the finals. picked 38 last year. Norman Powell, picked 46 in 2015. rotation player for a playoff team. Josh Richardson, rotation player for Miami. picked 40th in 2015. Nikola Jokic, picked 41st in 2014. building block for a team on the rise. Allen Crabbe, picked 31 in 2013 . Rotation player for a playoff team. Draymond green, picked 35 in 2012. building block for a championship team. Jae Crowder, picked 34 in 2012. Building block for a contender. Khris Middleton, picked 39 in 2012. Building block for a playoff team. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tank Vogel 191 Report post Posted June 23, 2017 Frank Mason probably isn't better than DJ Augustin at the NBA level, but we had chances at guys like Frank Jackson, Isisah Hartenstien, and Jonah Bolden and we should have taken them. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CTMagicUK 1,483 Report post Posted June 23, 2017 I'm ok with Isaac as the 6th pick. Definitely warmed to it. The rest of the draft is still a mystery for me. Hoping Iwundu proves me wrong but I thought there were better players on the board. The trades still suck. If no player drafted between 25 and 33 ever becomes anything though I guess we'll have got it right. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fultz4thewin 2,464 Report post Posted June 23, 2017 I didn't compare him. I said that could be his ceiling. I said KD LITE. KD had a coach who gave him a totally different role. You just can't ignore that variable. FSU should really fire leonard Hamilton. if only he gave Isaac a different role he could have had similar production to the greatest freshman basketball season that I can remember. :svgsad: Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Magicman28 295 Report post Posted June 23, 2017 I think the glaring question mark here in this whole equation, is Payton. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Soul Bro 1,419 Report post Posted June 23, 2017 how though? how can you reasonably project him to be paul George or the single most unique player in the NBA? it's irresponsible to put that kind of expectation on a guy. Why stop at Giannis? why not call him LeBron in Durant's body? This is no different than "Thon Maker is the next Garnett". how? why? just let a guy be a reasonable version of himself before we start throwing generational talent expectations around. I didn't project him to be George. I said that is his ceiling while his floor is Harkless. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Magicman28 295 Report post Posted June 23, 2017 FSU should really fire leonard Hamilton. if only he gave Isaac a different role he could have had similar production to the greatest freshman basketball season that I can remember. :svgsad:/>/>/> I don't get you some times man. You'll do a ton of research on some things and have some real thought out opinions. Then you'll throw these rare gems out like this which I'd expect from the drunken fan in upper level who thinks Joe Wolf was the **** just because of the howling sound affect when he makes his one or so basket. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheNameIsOrlando 310 Report post Posted June 23, 2017 yup. Why not use them to trade up a few picks? why not use the second rounder to find a place to dump Watson so you can take his full salary off the books instead of leaving the 1 million guaranteed? why not flip the second rounder for a 2018 second rounder so you can at least have it as a usable piece in a short term trade or a usable piece to shape your roster. Pretty much...its a lot easier to unload the bums on our team if you attach a pick to them. Good luck getting rid of our dead weight now. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
