Official 2015 Offseason Thread

[Catman 380]

I posted stats about his abysmal rating <3 feet from the basket a couple weeks ago in this very thread, once again, don't make stuff up about him...it's not going to fly anymore. I'm done talking about Harris until he has a chance to show or not show improvement.

 

You need to stop with this. I posted all the stats to back up my opinion. Just because they don;t fit your narrative does not mean they are made up. Again, all stats are easily looked up for anyone to see, so to keep saying Im making them up and not credible just appears to be petty at this point.

 

Your just being hard headed. Harris's contract, with cap inflation, is that of an 3rd to 4th option player. The cap is going to go up over the next few seasons. It's basic economics.

 

 

 

Exactly. Again, Murphy thinks Harris is one of the most overpaid players in the league. He has no math that backs that up in any way.

 

 

Well, arguably the best player on the team is locked up for 12m a season for the duration of Harris's contract. So right away you're subtracting 4m a season from one of those 4 players who is better than Harris.

 

Also: 2 years from now, Gordon, Payton and Hezonja will all still be on rookie contracts, so their combined price will be around 13m, and even a pessimistic projection most likely has that as at least 1 starter and two key bench players. So that's 1 starter and 2 bench players for 3m less than Harris will be making. Best case scenario, that's 3 starters for 13m that year and we've traded Oladipo for something, I guess.

 

So if that happens, our starting lineup costs a total of like 41m on a 90 million dollar cap. And even if we end up at the pessimistic view CAP wise, where our SL ends up being Payton on his rookie deal, Oladipo at 18m or so, Harris at 16m, someone else at 20m, and Vuc at 12m, that's still just 69m on a 90m CAP, with two key bench players combining to make about 10m. So that's our top 7 players at 79m? On a 90m CAP? And that concerns you? Really?

 

You do know it's not a hard cap, right?

 

 

Great breakdown. Unfortunately providing solid evidence and logic like this still does not seem to resonate with some people.

[Catman 380]

Yeah. And Gordon might just be a role player. And Payton might command a Mike Conley type salary (middle of the market).

 

If Hezonja is great and Gordon is great we probably trade Harris for depth.

 

If Oladipo ends up being a superstar and demands the special player max we can load up on free agents the same year so we don't waste the cap space.

 

This is all fluid. We have a lot of flexibility that other teams don't have.

 

This is really the big picture. When people can't see it, I just don't understand why. We have very tradable assets that should increase in value this next season.

 

Harris is a valued player on a tradeable contract. Apparently Murphy thinks that no other teams would want him on their team or take him on the deal we signed him with. He also doesn't believe that any other teams wanted to sign him for the same contract in free agency. I'm guessing that is because he did not sign an offer sheet.

 

The thing about that is - Rob told everyone he would match. And the Magic's cap space is so large that no team would call that bluff and tie up 15mm a year over the free agency period only to see the Magic match while they missed out on other free agent targets.

[Trey Time 186]

Correct. I'm on the same boat, parents from Angola

 

I giggled and I'm aware that I'm a terrible person for it.

[Trey Time 186]

Well, arguably the best player on the team is locked up for 12m a season for the duration of Harris's contract. So right away you're subtracting 4m a season from one of those 4 players who is better than Harris.

 

Also: 2 years from now, Gordon, Payton and Hezonja will all still be on rookie contracts, so their combined price will be around 13m, and even a pessimistic projection most likely has that as at least 1 starter and two key bench players. So that's 1 starter and 2 bench players for 3m less than Harris will be making. Best case scenario, that's 3 starters for 13m that year and we've traded Oladipo for something, I guess.

 

So if that happens, our starting lineup costs a total of like 41m on a 90 million dollar cap. And even if we end up at the pessimistic view CAP wise, where our SL ends up being Payton on his rookie deal, Oladipo at 18m or so, Harris at 16m, someone else at 20m, and Vuc at 12m, that's still just 69m on a 90m CAP, with two key bench players combining to make about 10m. So that's our top 7 players at 79m? On a 90m CAP? And that concerns you? Really?

 

You do know it's not a hard cap, right?

 

I'm going to ask a stupid question: why is CAP always capitalized?

[random 19]

For those who asked, we lost 15 games (+/- 1 game because I was keeping track in my head) that we were leading or tied going into the fourth quarter.

 

How many we did we win? We obviously didnt go 0-15 when we were leading or tied. Dont think its realistic to expect to win most of these 15 even with better coaching. But I agree its a big room for improvement there.

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

How many we did we win? We obviously didnt go 0-15 when we were leading or tied. Dont think its realistic to expect to win most of these 15 even with better coaching. But I agree its a big room for improvement there.

 

I think it is, good teams generally win games that they lead in the fourth. In fact, I believe that the majority of any teams' wins are those leading in the fourth quarter. I think we could grab another 6-7 wins out of that group.

[Murphy13 185]

Your projecting that the 4 ahead of him will, without a doubt, will be more of an contributor than Harris.

 

What if Harris comes in this season and drops 20 and 10 and makes all star reserves or something? Just hypothetically. He becomes an 1st option , 2nd option player getting paid 4th option money.

 

Was directly talking about monetary compensation. Payton4TW indicated he was getting paid 4-5 option money. Regardless of production, that suggested there were 4 tiers of pay above him. The point was that if he was indeed a fourth or fifth option signing then we would be capped out before we got to address the bench...that is all. I hope Harris becomes a 20/10 first option guy.

[Murphy13 185]

Well, arguably the best player on the team is locked up for 12m a season for the duration of Harris's contract. So right away you're subtracting 4m a season from one of those 4 players who is better than Harris.

 

Also: 2 years from now, Gordon, Payton and Hezonja will all still be on rookie contracts, so their combined price will be around 13m, and even a pessimistic projection most likely has that as at least 1 starter and two key bench players. So that's 1 starter and 2 bench players for 3m less than Harris will be making. Best case scenario, that's 3 starters for 13m that year and we've traded Oladipo for something, I guess.

 

So if that happens, our starting lineup costs a total of like 41m on a 90 million dollar cap. And even if we end up at the pessimistic view CAP wise, where our SL ends up being Payton on his rookie deal, Oladipo at 18m or so, Harris at 16m, someone else at 20m, and Vuc at 12m, that's still just 69m on a 90m CAP, with two key bench players combining to make about 10m. So that's our top 7 players at 79m? On a 90m CAP? And that concerns you? Really?

 

You do know it's not a hard cap, right?

 

If our top 7 players continually allow that much wiggle room for roster spots 8-11 relative to the cap then there are no concerns in the future. If you live in a world where we count on 4 of our top 7 players to be on rookie scale contracts (while being a contender, of course, the goal)and assume our sixth man and seventh man will get less than MLE money then we are trouble. That is not sustainable, which I thought was the mantra of this rebuild.

[ball junkie 277]

WOW !...Aaron Gordon broke his jaw and had to have surgery for fooling around with his brother at home:

 

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/sports/orlando-magic/os-aaron-gordon-recovering-from-fractured-jaw-20150717-story.html

[~O~ 565]

Luckily its the off season, not his legs or arms, and not a concussion.

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

If our top 7 players continually allow that much wiggle room for roster spots 8-11 relative to the cap then there are no concerns in the future. If you live in a world where we count on 4 of our top 7 players to be on rookie scale contracts (while being a contender, of course, the goal)and assume our sixth man and seventh man will get less than MLE money then we are trouble. That is not sustainable, which I thought was the mantra of this rebuild.

 

 

I like how you completely ignored me spelling out how the salaries will fit in order to keep your exasperation over the Harris contract. Bravo.

[Trey Time 186]

Pat Riley built a dynasty with 3 stars and like 6-7 D-Leaguers so...