Will Vince be better than Turk i.e. "Mr. 4th Quarter"?(link)

[The Solution 0]

What play would you like at the end of the game? Vince driving to the basket with the option to feed the ball to Lewis or Nelson and a chance of drawing a foul and DH getting the rebound and put in ....or a Hedo on the perimeter doing a pick and roll with Howard and the flailing arms at the end of the play hoping for a foul.

 

Do you remember how many times Hedo passed the ball, in close, to Howard? This is where Vince will make a big difference. Vince is combo guard and excellent passer in close range around the basket. Hedo is an excellent passer from the perimeter but not off the dribble!

[T REX 0]

This is an argument that will unfold next season. While Carter has had nice stats he hasn't done much recently team-wise. For as great as you guys claim he is the Nets sucked. I still don't think he'll beat the one opponent no one does....age. And at 33 next year. Rough, really rough.

[Kramer 0]

quote:

Originally posted by D-White:

From the list, here are the TOP 5 players in terms of FG% in the clutch:

 

1) carmelo anthony - 56.5%

2)lebron james - 55.6%

3) jameer nelson - 51.6%

4) rashard lewis - 51.1%

5) vince carter - 50.0%

 

1) jameer nelson - 60.0%

2) carmelo anthony - 58.3%

3) vince carter - 50.0%

4) paul pierce - 46.7%

5) rashard lewis - 43.5%

 

That is incredible. Thanks for the stat work guy

 

And one of the biggest criticisms Rashard has gotten from this board is his failures in the clutch. Well, I guess everybody was wrong

[Kramer 0]

quote:

Originally posted by T REX:

This is an argument that will unfold next season. While Carter has had nice stats he hasn't done much recently team-wise. For as great as you guys claim he is the Nets sucked. I still don't think he'll beat the one opponent no one does....age. And at 33 next year. Rough, really rough.

 

What had Hedo done prior to last season. The fact that we are holding a Carter Vs Hedo argument speaks volumes towards how overrated light skin colored atheletes seem to get. Hedo wasn't even a top 3 player on the Magic and we are replacing him with an 8 time All-Star super stud. Any comparison is bananas

[PEC 0]

quote:

Originally posted by T REX:

This is an argument that will unfold next season. While Carter has had nice stats he hasn't done much recently team-wise. For as great as you guys claim he is the Nets sucked. I still don't think he'll beat the one opponent no one does....age. And at 33 next year. Rough, really rough.

 

Yes the Nets sucked, but VC didn't, but if you take his stats and put them with the Magic we win the Finals instead of runner up.

VC needed to be on a better team and now he is that is a huge difference.

I will put him up against Hedo when it comes to being in shape considering their ages.

Plus VC is only here for two years at the most while Hedo has a long term contract with the Raptors. Just what the Magic didn't want and the best reason why Hedo isn't here anymore besides the money.

[ironarrow 0]

Hedo always played for contenders except his first few seasons with the Magic. Kings, Spurs, and Magic last season.

 

It is hard to average 20 ppg for a European rookie if you are joining the league on a contending team.

 

VC is the better overall player, sure. But he never played for a contender and his numbers will never be 24-25 ppg for the Magic. If they are that high here, then the Magic is in serious trouble!

 

I can easily imagine Hedo averaging 20+ppg on the Nets, very easily!

 

In fact, although not as crappy as the Nets, he might actually average around 20+ppg in Toronto.

 

Let's see how VC pulls it off when playing on a contending team. I am telling you already, he will not get his numbers here. If he gets frustrated because of that, watch the drama!

 

There is not way he will average his usual numbers for the Magic.. If he starts worrying about his numbers, that is a problem.. If he does get his numbers, there is a problem again as it is a sign of a one man show and not a team.

 

If Vince wants to do good for the Magic, he needs to learn how to cope and live with 19-20 ppg.

 

quote:

Originally posted by Kramer:

quote:

Originally posted by T REX:

This is an argument that will unfold next season. While Carter has had nice stats he hasn't done much recently team-wise. For as great as you guys claim he is the Nets sucked. I still don't think he'll beat the one opponent no one does....age. And at 33 next year. Rough, really rough.

 

What had Hedo done prior to last season. The fact that we are holding a Carter Vs Hedo argument speaks volumes towards how overrated light skin colored atheletes seem to get. Hedo wasn't even a top 3 player on the Magic and we are replacing him with an 8 time All-Star super stud. Any comparison is bananas

[Ambrose 0]

I'm glad we have VC instead of Hedo but the year before last he had his best season and he has been our 2nd and 3rd option for years.

quote:

Originally posted by ironarrow:

Hedo always played for contenders except his first few seasons with the Magic. Kings, Spurs, and Magic last season.

 

It is hard to average 20 ppg for a European rookie if you are joining the league on a contending team.

 

VC is the better overall player, sure. But he never played for a contender and his numbers will never be 24-25 ppg for the Magic. If they are that high here, then the Magic is in serious trouble!

 

I can easily imagine Hedo averaging 20+ppg on the Nets, very easily!

 

In fact, although not as crappy as the Nets, he might actually average around 20+ppg in Toronto.

 

Let's see how VC pulls it off when playing on a contending team. I am telling you already, he will not get his numbers here. If he gets frustrated because of that, watch the drama!

 

There is not way he will average his usual numbers for the Magic.. If he starts worrying about his numbers, that is a problem.. If he does get his numbers, there is a problem again as it is a sign of a one man show and not a team.

 

If Vince wants to do good for the Magic, he needs to learn how to cope and live with 19-20 ppg.

 

quote:

Originally posted by Kramer:

quote:

Originally posted by T REX:

This is an argument that will unfold next season. While Carter has had nice stats he hasn't done much recently team-wise. For as great as you guys claim he is the Nets sucked. I still don't think he'll beat the one opponent no one does....age. And at 33 next year. Rough, really rough.

 

What had Hedo done prior to last season. The fact that we are holding a Carter Vs Hedo argument speaks volumes towards how overrated light skin colored atheletes seem to get. Hedo wasn't even a top 3 player on the Magic and we are replacing him with an 8 time All-Star super stud. Any comparison is bananas

[Howard 0]

Just my opinion here, watching Dwight played in All Star game, it was exciting to see Lebron and Dwight play on the same team. The two of them create highlights after highlights.

 

VC is not lebron but I expect to see these running the floor play betwwn Dwight and VC.

 

Dwight and VC combination is scarier than Dwight and Hedo combination.

[Magic Turk 0]

HAPPY DAY, SAD DAY

June 29th, 2009 Last Thursday was a weird, weird day for me. First, I was so sad to hear that Michael Jackson died so suddenly. I have every song MJ ever put out and it

[ThisIsTheYear 241]

quote:

Originally posted by Magic Turk:

 

Turk has been here for five years and I feel like I owe part of my development as a player to him.

 

More like stunted his development.

 

quote:

He

[VinceCarter4life 69]

quote:

Originally posted by ironarrow:

Hedo always played for contenders except his first few seasons with the Magic. Kings, Spurs, and Magic last season.

 

It is hard to average 20 ppg for a European rookie if you are joining the league on a contending team.

 

VC is the better overall player, sure. But he never played for a contender and his numbers will never be 24-25 ppg for the Magic. If they are that high here, then the Magic is in serious trouble!

 

I can easily imagine Hedo averaging 20+ppg on the Nets, very easily!

 

In fact, although not as crappy as the Nets, he might actually average around 20+ppg in Toronto.

 

Let's see how VC pulls it off when playing on a contending team. I am telling you already, he will not get his numbers here. If he gets frustrated because of that, watch the drama!

 

There is not way he will average his usual numbers for the Magic.. If he starts worrying about his numbers, that is a problem.. If he does get his numbers, there is a problem again as it is a sign of a one man show and not a team.

 

If Vince wants to do good for the Magic, he needs to learn how to cope and live with 19-20 ppg.

 

well this fails. When ur NOT on a contender and ur the best person on the team U get Double teamed and even trippled when driving. Have fun averaging good stats with that going on.

He still put up good numbers, n last year he sacrificed his stats in development for young Devin Harris.

 

N ur telling me him having to settle for 19-20 ppg on the Magic is BAD?!

......

[VinceCarter4life 69]

quote:

Originally posted by D-White:

the stats used in the article does not give an accurate insight on comparing the "clutch-ness" of VC and hedo. what if it's a blowout win or loss for your team already and you're just padding stats?

 

a more accurate stat that can be used can be found in this link:

 

http://www.82games.com/0809/CSORT7.HTM

 

it shows the stats of players during the last 5 minutes of the 4th quarter or overtime when neither team is ahead by more than 5 points.

 

from the list, i took a sample of wing players and some point guards to see how carter compares with the rest of the league. here are the players i sampled:

 

joe johnson, ray allen, paul pierce, ben gordon, lebron james, chauncey billups, carmelo anthony, danny granger, kobe bryant, dwayne wade, hedo turkoglu, rashard lewis, jameer nelson, andre iguodala, brandon roy, kevin martin, manu ginobili, caron butler, vince carter

 

that's a pretty good list.

 

from the link, i think the best measure of a player's clutch-ness is his FG% and 3PT-FG% in the clutch because it shows us that when given the opportunity, what are the chances that you will make the shot?

 

so, are you ready to be surprised?

 

before going to carter, let's check hedo. from the list above, hedo is dead-last in FG% in the clutch, shooting a horrific 35.7 FG%. he is also 3rd to the last in 3PT-FG% shooting just 20.0% from 3 point land. people remember when he makes clutch shots, but some tend to forget how many bad/forced shots hedo takes in the clutch.

 

so how does VC fare? VC is 5th in the list in FG% making 50.0% of his shots from the field during clutch situations. that's a very, very solid FG% to have in the clutch. but here's where it gets better. VC is 3rd in the list in 3PT-FG% shooting 50.0% also from 3 point land!!!!! 50% from the field is good, but 50% from the 3 point land is simply amazing. and he did all this last season in a bad new jersey team where he probably was the center of the opposing team's defense.

 

so we lose hedo who shoots bad in the clutch and get VC who excels well in those situations.

 

but wait, there's actually more good news. vince alone can't do it for the magic. what happens if he gets double-teamed? enter: jameer nelson and rashard lewis.

 

From the list, here are the TOP 5 players in terms of FG% in the clutch:

 

1) carmelo anthony - 56.5%

2)lebron james - 55.6%

3) jameer nelson - 51.6%

4) rashard lewis - 51.1%

5) vince carter - 50.0%

 

other notable players in the list: wade is 8th with 47.0%, kobe 10th (45.7%), pierce 12th (45.1%)

 

Needing a bucket to win or seal the game? no problem. we can turn to any of the three. but what if we need a three?

 

From the list, here are the TOP 5 players in terms of 3PT-FG% in the clutch:

 

1) jameer nelson - 60.0%

2) carmelo anthony - 58.3%

3) vince carter - 50.0%

4) paul pierce - 46.7%

5) rashard lewis - 43.5%

 

 

so. anyone like our chances of winning it all next season? imo, we have the most clutch team in the NBA right now.

 

+1000102012931203123912048

 

I was waiting for someone to actually use stats in the correct way. Thank u very much man.

 

Vabchmagic fan: U need tto take some of my advice.

 

Ur relying way to heavily on stats. U can't even compare the two unless u actually have watched Vince play in a game before. It's easy to do many things with stats.

 

T-Rex: Gtfo plz. Everytime u get destroyed in an argument of u talking out ur butt, you just ignore it and start a new blind statement. STOP we understand you hate the VC. Its starting to get annoying.