Gianto 4 Report post Posted November 12, 2008 I believe this is a "glass half full/half empty" situation. Players who were traded away may really start showing better qualities... or maybe we start focusing to their better sides once they leave. Posters on this forum have tendency to over-value what they don't have and under-value what they have. If Ariza was still in a Magic uniform, we'd be talking the 5 3's he missed instead of the 6 3's he made. Or we'd be opening sarcastic polls on ft %'s... If nothing else, we'd find a sure way to make fun of him like we do to some of the current players, about their illnesses, tattoos, ethnic origins... or facial hairs.. Isn't it time to start supporting "ALL players who wear a magic uniform" yet??? Seriously, start focusing (and supporting) on our players than "not-ours-anymore" players. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shine88 80 Report post Posted November 12, 2008 quote: Originally posted by Drunk on Mystery: quote: Originally posted by truth393:You can add Ariza to the list with Billups, Ben Wallace, Gooden, and Varejao. This are players we had, who went on to have better career when they left the Magic. Using Varejao and Billups in this example is a little silly since neither actually played a game with the team. Who's fault is that? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marc Acres 3:16 418 Report post Posted November 12, 2008 quote: Originally posted by truth393: quote: Originally posted by Drunk on Mystery: quote: Originally posted by truth393:You can add Ariza to the list with Billups, Ben Wallace, Gooden, and Varejao. This are players we had, who went on to have better career when they left the Magic. Using Varejao and Billups in this example is a little silly since neither actually played a game with the team. Who's fault is that? Weisbrod and Gabriel, but they aren't here anymore. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shine88 80 Report post Posted November 12, 2008 quote: Originally posted by Marc Acres 3:16: quote: Originally posted by truth393: quote: Originally posted by Drunk on Mystery: quote: Originally posted by truth393:You can add Ariza to the list with Billups, Ben Wallace, Gooden, and Varejao. This are players we had, who went on to have better career when they left the Magic. Using Varejao and Billups in this example is a little silly since neither actually played a game with the team. Who's fault is that? Weisbrod and Gabriel, but they aren't here anymore. Thank You Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SmackDaddy 30 Report post Posted November 12, 2008 quote: Originally posted by Marc Acres 3:16:Who's fault is that? Weisbrod and Gabriel, but they aren't here anymore. I think his point was that the Magic organization still didn't see the value in those players. What we are discussing here are the players that the Magic didn't give a chance to play. Certainly players that were on our roster that never played a game qualify to make that list. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Secretly Space Jesus 670 Report post Posted November 12, 2008 quote: Originally posted by truth393: quote: Originally posted by Drunk on Mystery: quote: Originally posted by truth393:You can add Ariza to the list with Billups, Ben Wallace, Gooden, and Varejao. This are players we had, who went on to have better career when they left the Magic. Using Varejao and Billups in this example is a little silly since neither actually played a game with the team. Who's fault is that? What I meant was that you can't really fault a team for failing to develop a player when the player wasn't around long enough to be developed anyway. Blaming a team's management for failing to develop young players is a worthy criticism, but blaming them for failing to develop young players who never even suited up with the team is just silly. Zaza Pachulia is a player we let get away as a way of protecting Grant Hill's ego. Varejao is a player who was on the team in name only. It's hard to feel bad about losing a player who was never *really* on the team. It's the same reason I don't care about Rodney Stuckey: because we didn't trade Stuckey. We traded a mid first round pick. The Magic had no real way of knowing that draft was going to turn out as deep as it did. The 15th pick the year before was Cedric Simmons and the year before that it was Antoine Wright. Not exactly high quality. Side note: Has there ever been a draft as deep for solid 3rd or 4th option players and bench role players, that was also so utterly bereft of stars as the 2007 draft? With the exception of Durant and maybe Oden, there isn't a single player out of that draft who looks like they'll ever be an allstar, and yet probably a solid half of the players in those two rounds are in their team's rotations. It's bizarre. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SmackDaddy 30 Report post Posted November 12, 2008 2007 Draft: 48th pick - Marc Gasol 56th pick - Ramon Sessions There are half a dozen other players drafted in the second round also playing decent roles for their teams. Crazy Deep. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shine88 80 Report post Posted November 12, 2008 quote: Originally posted by Drunk on Mystery: quote: Originally posted by truth393: quote: Originally posted by Drunk on Mystery: quote: Originally posted by truth393:You can add Ariza to the list with Billups, Ben Wallace, Gooden, and Varejao. This are players we had, who went on to have better career when they left the Magic. Using Varejao and Billups in this example is a little silly since neither actually played a game with the team. Who's fault is that? What I meant was that you can't really fault a team for failing to develop a player when the player wasn't around long enough to be developed anyway. Blaming a team's management for failing to develop young players is a worthy criticism, but blaming them for failing to develop young players who never even suited up with the team is just silly. Zaza Pachulia is a player we let get away as a way of protecting Grant Hill's ego. Varejao is a player who was on the team in name only. It's hard to feel bad about losing a player who was never *really* on the team. It's the same reason I don't care about Rodney Stuckey: because we didn't trade Stuckey. We traded a mid first round pick. The Magic had no real way of knowing that draft was going to turn out as deep as it did. The 15th pick the year before was Cedric Simmons and the year before that it was Antoine Wright. Not exactly high quality. Side note: Has there ever been a draft as deep for solid 3rd or 4th option players and bench role players, that was also so utterly bereft of stars as the 2007 draft? With the exception of Durant and maybe Oden, there isn't a single player out of that draft who looks like they'll ever be an allstar, and yet probably a solid half of the players in those two rounds are in their team's rotations. It's bizarre. Stuckey and Varejao situation is completely different. Varejao was actually on our team, he came in with Howard and Nelson in the 2004 draft, Stuckey was never apart of the Magic, so there a big different between the two. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Penny Hardaway's Ghost 260 Report post Posted November 12, 2008 hindsight is 20/20... didn't Billups have some really bad knee or shoulder injury when he was traded to us from Denver? I'm having a hard time remembering exactly what type of injury it was... it happens... on that note, man I hated losing Chris Gatling and Abdul-Wahad...Wahad was like our Ariza back then, I really thought he was going to mature into a big time contributor...I guess I was a bit off there...That kid could pull down some monstrous rebounds, didnt get a lot of them, but pull them out of the heavens... sigh Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shine88 80 Report post Posted November 12, 2008 quote: there isn't a single player out of that draft who looks like they'll ever be an allstar, and yet probably a solid half of the players in those two rounds are in their team's rotations. It's bizarre. I guess you haven't hear of Rudy Fernandez, Ramon Sessions, and Marc Gasol. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Secretly Space Jesus 670 Report post Posted November 12, 2008 quote: Originally posted by truth393: quote: there isn't a single player out of that draft who looks like they'll ever be an allstar, and yet probably a solid half of the players in those two rounds are in their team's rotations. It's bizarre. I guess you haven't hear of Rudy Fernandez, Ramon Sessions, and Marc Gasol. No, I just don't think any of them will ever be all-stars. Hell, none of them are even in the top 3 players on their own teams. And since this board is entirely too predictable: Memphis: Gay, Mayo, Conley Milwaukee: Jefferson, Redd, Bogut Portland: Roy, Aldridge, Oden Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Luke_FfS 248 Report post Posted November 12, 2008 quote: Originally posted by Drunk on Mystery:No, I just don't think any of them will ever be all-stars. Hell, none of them are even in the top 3 players on their own teams. And since this board is entirely too predictable: Memphis: Gay, Mayo, Conley Milwaukee: Jefferson, Redd, Bogut Portland: Roy, Aldridge, Oden Agree with the concept, corrected one name. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
