2023-2024 General Game Thread

[Jon 30]

4 hours ago, CTMagicUK said:

I'm on record as believing Markelle is the odd man out on this roster but there's a lot of small sample size at play with these stats. A 4 game sample is nowhere near definitive enough to prove that Paolo is better without Markelle. It might well be true over the long term. But it could just as easily be written off as a a Paolo slump to start the season, we need more data. And fortunately (or unfortunately if you're very against Markelle returning to the SL) we'll likely get some this season in time to make a decision on Markelle both short (trade deadline) and long (free agency) term.

You can check last season and see that to be the case as well. This isn’t just 4 games.

[jmmagicfan 302]

1 hour ago, Jon said:

You can check last season and see that to be the case as well. This isn’t just 4 games.

2022-23 season record

5-17 without Fultz

29-31 with Fultz

The team was better with him, regardless of anyone else’s stats; last I knew winning games was more important than individual stats.

[fan for too long 2 534]

2 hours ago, jmmagicfan said:

2022-23 season record

5-17 without Fultz

29-31 with Fultz

The team was better with him, regardless of anyone else’s stats; last I knew winning games was more important than individual stats.

I’m with you on Fultz, he also regressed this year before the tendinitis. But to think AB is a solution for the season is just dreaming. Also playing Ingles as a point forward is gonna work in the post season is just laughable. 

[Jon 30]

2 hours ago, jmmagicfan said:

2022-23 season record

5-17 without Fultz

29-31 with Fultz

The team was better with him, regardless of anyone else’s stats; last I knew winning games was more important than individual stats.

That’s not even 500 basketball.

What’s our record atm? 
 

We’re better with him despite this being our best season and we’re doing it without him? 

[Jay Magic 1,251]

Am i right in saying we could have up to 50 plus million in cap space next season?

[CTMagicUK 1,488]

4 hours ago, Jay Magic said:

Am i right in saying we could have up to 50 plus million in cap space next season?

We currently have 104m on the books, the cap is predicted to be at 142m, difference of 38m. Joe Ingles has an 11m team option that's counted as part of that 104m so if we decline that we get to 49m. Isaac is also non guaranteed so could add another 17m to that but that seems unlikely. 

Worth noting that Franz, Suggs (and Isaac but again I think that's less likely to happen) are extension eligible and Franz is getting a max. 

EDIT: also Gary, Fultz, Goga and Chuma are free agents.

EDIT2: we also currently have a first round pick so that player will have a guaranteed salary but it depends on where we pick how much that is. Something like 3-4m if we pick in the 16-22 range. 

EDIT3(lol): for some reason the website I was using didnt have Mo Wagner with a team option but other sites do. I'm pretty sure he does so we could also decline that for an extra 8m in salary (can't imagine we'd do that).

[CTMagicUK 1,488]

With the above in mind, I can't really see any big free agents out there that strike me as good fits with what we're doing (mostly based on age to be honest, OG is the only one from a quick glance but I'm not sure where he starts with Suggs/Franz/Paolo at the 2/3/4). So I think the most likely thing we do is extend Franz and Suggs to eat up any cap room we could have and then operate as an over the cap team.

If I had to guess I'd say we keep Mo Wagner and Joe Ingles (I'd be tempted to decline the option and offer him a cheaper number... That's a tricky thing to do without pissing someone off though, you'd have to have had a lot of conversations with him and his agent before hand so maybe you just pay him the 11m unless you think you really really need to cut a couple mil to stay under the tax).

Then since we'd be operating over the cap we'd have the 13m-ish MLE to shop with. You're not likely getting a starting PG at that price (maybe Spencer Dinwiddie I guess? Maybe? He might want more) and we're pretty set at every other position so maybe just go and get a wing, can never have too many of those, guys like Royce O Neal, Kyle Anderson, Caleb Martin, Saddiq Bey off the top of my head are all worthy of varying levels of interest I think.

I have no idea who of Harris, Goga and Fultz we bring back to be honest. I'd hope for Goga because this team really does need a decent third big with Wendell generally missing 20+ games a season. Harris and Fultz are toss ups I think at the minute. Id miss both but if you're bringing guys in (and developing AB, Jett and Caleb) you need minutes for them to play. 

Chuma I'd be pretty surprised if he was brought back. Wish him well and I wouldn't be surprised if he carves out a role somewhere but I do think he needs a change of scenery to do that. 

 

[Jay Magic 1,251]

1 hour ago, CTMagicUK said:

With the above in mind, I can't really see any big free agents out there that strike me as good fits with what we're doing (mostly based on age to be honest, OG is the only one from a quick glance but I'm not sure where he starts with Suggs/Franz/Paolo at the 2/3/4). So I think the most likely thing we do is extend Franz and Suggs to eat up any cap room we could have and then operate as an over the cap team.

If I had to guess I'd say we keep Mo Wagner and Joe Ingles (I'd be tempted to decline the option and offer him a cheaper number... That's a tricky thing to do without pissing someone off though, you'd have to have had a lot of conversations with him and his agent before hand so maybe you just pay him the 11m unless you think you really really need to cut a couple mil to stay under the tax).

Then since we'd be operating over the cap we'd have the 13m-ish MLE to shop with. You're not likely getting a starting PG at that price (maybe Spencer Dinwiddie I guess? Maybe? He might want more) and we're pretty set at every other position so maybe just go and get a wing, can never have too many of those, guys like Royce O Neal, Kyle Anderson, Caleb Martin, Saddiq Bey off the top of my head are all worthy of varying levels of interest I think.

I have no idea who of Harris, Goga and Fultz we bring back to be honest. I'd hope for Goga because this team really does need a decent third big with Wendell generally missing 20+ games a season. Harris and Fultz are toss ups I think at the minute. Id miss both but if you're bringing guys in (and developing AB, Jett and Caleb) you need minutes for them to play. 

Chuma I'd be pretty surprised if he was brought back. Wish him well and I wouldn't be surprised if he carves out a role somewhere but I do think he needs a change of scenery to do that. 

 

Paul George?

[CTMagicUK 1,488]

12 minutes ago, Jay Magic said:

Paul George?

In his age 33 through (possibly up to) 37 seasons? A guy who hasn't played 60+ games since 18-19? For (I'm presuming) $40+m a season? 

Why? 

 

[MagicMan1979 107]

1 hour ago, CTMagicUK said:

With the above in mind, I can't really see any big free agents out there that strike me as good fits with what we're doing (mostly based on age to be honest, OG is the only one from a quick glance but I'm not sure where he starts with Suggs/Franz/Paolo at the 2/3/4). So I think the most likely thing we do is extend Franz and Suggs to eat up any cap room we could have and then operate as an over the cap team.

If I had to guess I'd say we keep Mo Wagner and Joe Ingles (I'd be tempted to decline the option and offer him a cheaper number... That's a tricky thing to do without pissing someone off though, you'd have to have had a lot of conversations with him and his agent before hand so maybe you just pay him the 11m unless you think you really really need to cut a couple mil to stay under the tax).

Then since we'd be operating over the cap we'd have the 13m-ish MLE to shop with. You're not likely getting a starting PG at that price (maybe Spencer Dinwiddie I guess? Maybe? He might want more) and we're pretty set at every other position so maybe just go and get a wing, can never have too many of those, guys like Royce O Neal, Kyle Anderson, Caleb Martin, Saddiq Bey off the top of my head are all worthy of varying levels of interest I think.

I have no idea who of Harris, Goga and Fultz we bring back to be honest. I'd hope for Goga because this team really does need a decent third big with Wendell generally missing 20+ games a season. Harris and Fultz are toss ups I think at the minute. Id miss both but if you're bringing guys in (and developing AB, Jett and Caleb) you need minutes for them to play. 

Chuma I'd be pretty surprised if he was brought back. Wish him well and I wouldn't be surprised if he carves out a role somewhere but I do think he needs a change of scenery to do that. 

 

Great analysis and thank you for looking all these salaries up for everyone. After reading what you wrote it does seem to me we should make a trade in season and throw in one of our three picks over the next two years potentially.  We don’t need 3 more rookies to develop. Free agency doesn’t seem to be the way to go and hasn’t been for a few years. I am a Fultz fan but I am not sure he fits as people have been writing here for the last few days (I do think he would be very cheap if we want to keep him).  With him and Harris being free agents I would hate to lose the assets for nothing. If we could get another high level rotation player that fits that would be ideal. There are not a lot of great names admittedly. 

[Jay Magic 1,251]

55 minutes ago, CTMagicUK said:

In his age 33 through (possibly up to) 37 seasons? A guy who hasn't played 60+ games since 18-19? For (I'm presuming) $40+m a season? 

Why? 

 

wont lie i really am a massive fan or PG but your point stands. 

[TreyMachine 398]

I agree with CT on all these and will continue to preach - we're drafting good players, creating culture, and then signing them to long term deals to generally stay within the cap. 

We're not going to take a big swing on a free agent that puts us at the cap with a need to extend Paolo to a max in 2 years to send us way over the cap cliff. We're a small market team and we want a championship, but we're not going to put ourselves in cap jeopardy by signing someone to a deal just to make a splash. 

But if we do... it's definitely going to be before we sign Franz / Suggs to deals.