Fultz4thewin 2,464 Report post Posted February 12, 2017 As I already said, I don't believe he's in that particular realm as depicted by the advanced stats. That's exactly why I made a long detailed diatribe a couple years ago lamenting the fallibility of such blind application of these stats. It wasn't popular then. This is also why I found the conversation a couple days ago humorous when someone was trying to tell me about advanced stats and tell me I 'obviously' lacked experience with them. If only he knew... That being said, seeing as how those specific stats were seemingly your fav not long ago when discussing AG and other players it would seem disingenuous now to discount them when they aren't convenient. We both have been around long enough to know that you can find any stat to make whatever point you're trying to make. You found one. There are far more that suggest otherwise, but there are no winners in this argument because I want AG to be the best defender in the league...it's the only way he will live up to his pick and the only way we will climb out of this hole we are in currently. I still use advanced stats. But they need to be used in conjunction with the entirety of data available along with situational context. Because single data points have a ton of noise. Just because something is true doesn't necessarily mean it's casually related to anything. Like every team in the bottom 5 has a croatian on the roster and the top 25 has zero croatians. But i don't really think that's really telling. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
HeHateMe 697 Report post Posted February 12, 2017 I forgot a comma my fault. That 31 point game was this year. Your eyes must be heavy. Please just go on record and say you like Rob. You support all of his head scrater trades and signings, also please add the that the only reason he has done bad is because of no "luck". IN HENNY I TRUST Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
HeHateMe 697 Report post Posted February 12, 2017 I still use advanced stats. But they need to be used in conjunction with the entirety of data available along with situational context. Because single data points have a ton of noise. Just because something is true doesn't necessarily mean it's casually related to anything. Like every team in the bottom 5 has a croatian on the roster and the top 25 has zero croatians. But i don't really think that's really telling. The point is, and this is nothing new--but people overrate AG, even on the defensive end. He's just an athletic tweener with no defined role in his 3rd year in the league. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fultz4thewin 2,464 Report post Posted February 12, 2017 I feel like this is becoming a circular conversation in different replies. Truly elite defensive players shine through statistically across the mean, regardless of team dynamic. Drating (and Orating) is far from my favorite stat, but it can be seen as the canvas that the picture is being painted on. It builds an idea, but it doesn't define it. But that's really only true with centers because they're positioned for help defense. Gordon can be the best defensive wing of all time and it wouldn't make a difference if Augustin gives up a layup or Mario forgets to rotate. This is evident with how some teams were dealing with kawhi this year. They basically conceded that they couldn't score on him so they sacrificed whoever he was defending to the weak side corner and ran their action on the strong side. The result is a weird situation where the advanced stats suggest that kawhi is a terrible defender. Specifically his on/off defensive rating. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fultz4thewin 2,464 Report post Posted February 12, 2017 The point is, and this is nothing new--but people overrate AG, even on the defensive end. He's just an athletic tweener with no defined role in his 3rd year in the league. He's not overrated on the defensive end though. He's an elite defensive wing as evidenced by his defense against harden, lillard, and mccollum. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
UEBERMORTAL 125 Report post Posted February 12, 2017 The point is, and this is nothing new--but people overrate AG, even on the defensive end. He's just an athletic tweener with no defined role in his 3rd year in the league. AG is a good and skilled defender, the question is more, do you want to build a team around him? I personally don't see any current player being our 'next' superstar. It's time to again blow this entire team up and hope for the best. We need to rebuild through the draft, some expiring contracts and maybe some young, currently underwelming player, which can develop into good role players. But keep it realistic, this roster will not get us a superstar. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
A Better DJ & Photographer 457 Report post Posted February 12, 2017 Mario had 7 points and 3 turnovers... He did great then~ at the time I posted he had 2 points and 3 turnovers. Like i said we need to start him every game 'til the end of the season and see what we really have. If he does well we keep him, if he still sucks it's time to move on. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pootie Tang 44 Report post Posted February 12, 2017 As I already said, I don't believe he's in that particular realm as depicted by the advanced stats. That's exactly why I made a long detailed diatribe a couple years ago lamenting the fallibility of such blind application of these stats. It wasn't popular then. This is also why I found the conversation a couple days ago humorous when someone was trying to tell me about advanced stats and tell me I 'obviously' lacked experience with them. If only he knew... Still pretty obvious. You're "argument" in this thread only further proves it Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jay Magic 1,248 Report post Posted February 12, 2017 Vooch said that there are other reasons why we are bad but that is not for him to say in the media right now.. It will come out later?? WTF.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Soul Bro 1,419 Report post Posted February 12, 2017 Vooch said that there are other reasons why we are bad but that is not for him to say in the media right now.. It will come out later?? WTF.... Ummmm... this should be interesting Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Magicman28 295 Report post Posted February 12, 2017 Vooch said that there are other reasons why we are bad but that is not for him to say in the media right now.. It will come out later?? WTF.... This is like a soap opera now. We're the friggin Kings. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Magicman28 295 Report post Posted February 12, 2017 He must think he's gonna be traded Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
