Is It Time for Rob to Go?

[Mauro Pedrosa 1,032]

I find it funny when I see people post this. 5 years. It's a drop in the bucket compared to most teams that have been around longer.

True.

[Franchise408 116]

I find it funny when I see people post this. 5 years. It's a drop in the bucket compared to most teams that have been around longer.

 

And?

 

We should be okay with failure just because other franchises have failed harder?

 

Absolutely not. That's the mentality that leads to the "tank" philosophy. "Just lose, because eventually you'll luck draft your way out of it"

 

Sorry, I'm not content with being an irrelevant and losing franchise for decades, and that is not a model we should aspire to just because other franchises have failed for longer

[Magicman28 295]

And?

 

We should be okay with failure just because other franchises have failed harder?

 

Absolutely not. That's the mentality that leads to the "tank" philosophy. "Just lose, because eventually you'll luck draft your way out of it"

 

Sorry, I'm not content with being an irrelevant and losing franchise for decades, and that is not a model we should aspire to just because other franchises have failed for longer

 

 

Yes you should be ok with failure because that's life. You fail. If you haven't personally failed, welcome to Earth. We humans fail more times than we succeed.

 

Here's what you are "failing" to understand. Tmac was a different scenerio. He's the hometown kid who wanted his own team. He wanted to spread his wings if you will. Championship was on the agenda but he wanted be the man. What better place to do that than here an hour away from home and collecting a fat check as a max fa as well. Last few years, guys who are already the man, are leaving to chase the rings. They've joined super teams so they can get the chance. They have FAILED in that quest. Which is why they go elsewhere. Tmac had an old school mentality. Be the man, lead teams to championships. Not join an stack team and be second or third fiddle. Tmac was about legacy. Look at LeBron. He could've stayed and won more but he decided somewhere in his journey winning in Cleveland would cement that. Winning a ship in Cleveland imo was instrumental in him building a legacy than the ones in Miami.

 

Look I can say a million times over and over again I'm gonna be a millionaire and nothing less. Doesn't mean jack **** unless I do the work which means I'll more than likely fail a bunch to get there.

 

Also remember the model isn't what Rob or any other GM invented. It's the NBA model. Everyone else is just playing the game and the CBA now will make draft even more important. Three of those 5 years were losses by design. Why? You think Rob all of a sudden had this never before bright idea how losing gets you another shot at a possible franchise player? Come on. Rob knows the system. Just like Hinkie knew. He just knew it was going to take a while. Problem is you have impatient owners meshed with impatient fans of a organization who've never had to experience, and your comment is proof, a long wait.

[JJZFL 619]

Yes you should be ok with failure because that's life. You fail. If you haven't personally failed, welcome to Earth. We humans fail more times than we succeed.

 

Here's what you are "failing" to understand. Tmac was a different scenerio. He's the hometown kid who wanted his own team. He wanted to spread his wings if you will. Championship was on the agenda but he wanted be the man. What better place to do that than here an hour away from home and collecting a fat check as a max fa as well. Last few years, guys who are already the man, are leaving to chase the rings. They've joined super teams so they can get the chance. They have FAILED in that quest. Which is why they go elsewhere. Tmac had an old school mentality. Be the man, lead teams to championships. Not join an stack team and be second or third fiddle. Tmac was about legacy. Look at LeBron. He could've stayed and won more but he decided somewhere in his journey winning in Cleveland would cement that. Winning a ship in Cleveland imo was instrumental in him building a legacy than the ones in Miami.

 

Look I can say a million times over and over again I'm gonna be a millionaire and nothing less. Doesn't mean jack **** unless I do the work which means I'll more than likely fail a bunch to get there.

 

Also remember the model isn't what Rob or any other GM invented. It's the NBA model. Everyone else is just playing the game and the CBA now will make draft even more important. Three of those 5 years were losses by design. Why? You think Rob all of a sudden had this never before bright idea how losing gets you another shot at a possible franchise player? Come on. Rob knows the system. Just like Hinkie knew. He just knew it was going to take a while. Problem is you have impatient owners meshed with impatient fans of a organization who've never had to experience, and your comment is proof, a long wait.

 

You make the strongest arguments for a strategy of losing I've ever seen. Just want to make sure you're aware that pro sports is about WINNING. It's not about every team being bad in some weird kind of rotation, waiting until it's "their turn" to land a star player.

 

We're aware that the current horrific version of the Magic was built by design. That's nothing to be proud of. It will rightfully cost Hennigan his job, and can't happen soon enough. Stockholm Syndrome is the only way I can explain some in this forum wanting him to stay on. Either that or an unwillingness to admit how totally wrong they were about him.

[Magicman28 295]

You make the strongest arguments for a strategy of losing I've ever seen. Just want to make sure you're aware that pro sports is about WINNING. It's not about every team being bad in some weird kind of rotation, waiting until it's "their turn" to land a star player.

 

We're aware that the current horrific version of the Magic was built by design. That's nothing to be proud of. It will rightfully cost Hennigan his job, and can't happen soon enough. Stockholm Syndrome is the only way I can explain some in this forum wanting him to stay on. Either that or an unwillingness to admit how totally wrong they were about him.

 

 

Eh you got no substance. You're the guy who thinks the off season is about shooting jumpers in an empty gym.

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

You make the strongest arguments for a strategy of losing I've ever seen. Just want to make sure you're aware that pro sports is about WINNING. It's not about every team being bad in some weird kind of rotation, waiting until it's "their turn" to land a star player.

 

We're aware that the current horrific version of the Magic was built by design. That's nothing to be proud of. It will rightfully cost Hennigan his job, and can't happen soon enough. Stockholm Syndrome is the only way I can explain some in this forum wanting him to stay on. Either that or an unwillingness to admit how totally wrong they were about him.

 

That's like arguing against going to college because the goal is to make money, not spend it

[The Boss 129]

I was a huge Henny fan but I think it's time we move on from him, but not just him, a lot of others high up.

 

To try and say it's mainly his fault we are terrible and had our worst win-loss ratio era is pretty unfair. He took over a franchise that was in a horrible spot, roster/contract wise we were probably the worst team in the NBA. Our only good player cried his way out and we were never gonna get anything near equal value for him. We had to start from scratch. I think Henny did a great job in the early days, he took the best deal that was available for Dwight and he then did a great job getting rid of all the terrible contracts we had on the team. I think with his draft picks and early trades he did well, JJ Redick trade was great, Oladipo was a good pick in that draft. I think he was unlucky with ping pong balls and things could have been very different if we landed a KAT, Wiggins, Embiid etc. Once we didn't get a franchise player to build around things started to go sour, I think he started to make some bad moves, whether it be because of pressure from above or just poor judgement. The deals were made though and the responsibility has to be put on him and I think it's time we moved on.

 

I honestly think that Henny's good work early on in the job in the end will come back to bite him in the ass. I think we never got as bad as we should have, we should have had the worst record in the league for a couple years running but we didn't. We weren't bad enough to get a really good player from the draft so we couldn't fast track a rebuild. When you can't get a great young player to build around, a re-build is always going to take a very long time, too long for most fans or management to allow.

 

Having said that, we have to judge his work as a whole, I think his last few moves will cost him his job, and rightly so IMO. I think it could have been because of pressure to make the playoffs but either way the moves were made and he'll have to suffer the consequences for them.

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

I was a huge Henny fan but I think it's time we move on from him, but not just him, a lot of others high up.

 

To try and say it's mainly his fault we are terrible and had our worst win-loss ratio era is pretty unfair. He took over a franchise that was in a horrible spot, roster/contract wise we were probably the worst team in the NBA. Our only good player cried his way out and we were never gonna get anything near equal value for him. We had to start from scratch. I think Henny did a great job in the early days, he took the best deal that was available for Dwight and he then did a great job getting rid of all the terrible contracts we had on the team. I think with his draft picks and early trades he did well, JJ Redick trade was great, Oladipo was a good pick in that draft. I think he was unlucky with ping pong balls and things could have been very different if we landed a KAT, Wiggins, Embiid etc. Once we didn't get a franchise player to build around things started to go sour, I think he started to make some bad moves, whether it be because of pressure from above or just poor judgement. The deals were made though and the responsibility has to be put on him and I think it's time we moved on.

 

I honestly think that Henny's good work early on in the job in the end will come back to bite him in the ass. I think we never got as bad as we should have, we should have had the worst record in the league for a couple years running but we didn't. We weren't bad enough to get a really good player from the draft so we couldn't fast track a rebuild. When you can't get a great young player to build around, a re-build is always going to take a very long time, too long for most fans or management to allow.

 

Having said that, we have to judge his work as a whole, I think his last few moves will cost him his job, and rightly so IMO. I think it could have been because of pressure to make the playoffs but either way the moves were made and he'll have to suffer the consequences for them.

 

This is fair

[Franchise408 116]

Yes you should be ok with failure because that's life. You fail. If you haven't personally failed, welcome to Earth. We humans fail more times than we succeed.

 

Here's what you are "failing" to understand. Tmac was a different scenerio. He's the hometown kid who wanted his own team. He wanted to spread his wings if you will. Championship was on the agenda but he wanted be the man. What better place to do that than here an hour away from home and collecting a fat check as a max fa as well. Last few years, guys who are already the man, are leaving to chase the rings. They've joined super teams so they can get the chance. They have FAILED in that quest. Which is why they go elsewhere. Tmac had an old school mentality. Be the man, lead teams to championships. Not join an stack team and be second or third fiddle. Tmac was about legacy. Look at LeBron. He could've stayed and won more but he decided somewhere in his journey winning in Cleveland would cement that. Winning a ship in Cleveland imo was instrumental in him building a legacy than the ones in Miami.

 

Look I can say a million times over and over again I'm gonna be a millionaire and nothing less. Doesn't mean jack **** unless I do the work which means I'll more than likely fail a bunch to get there.

 

Also remember the model isn't what Rob or any other GM invented. It's the NBA model. Everyone else is just playing the game and the CBA now will make draft even more important. Three of those 5 years were losses by design. Why? You think Rob all of a sudden had this never before bright idea how losing gets you another shot at a possible franchise player? Come on. Rob knows the system. Just like Hinkie knew. He just knew it was going to take a while. Problem is you have impatient owners meshed with impatient fans of a organization who've never had to experience, and your comment is proof, a long wait.

 

Clearly you have a very low bar.

 

Long term mediocrity might be acceptable for you. But it is not acceptable for me.

 

When you fail, you typically learn from your mistakes and get better from it. My lowest lows in life have led me to my highest highs, because I learned from my mistakes so I could become better.

 

What has Hennigan learned? How has he gotten better? This team is in the exact same spot it was in when he took over. We have not improved. We have not collected talent. We have just spun our wheels in the mud the entire time he's been here.

 

His failures have been in vain.

 

Be better.

[Magicman28 295]

Clearly you have a very low bar.

 

Long term mediocrity might be acceptable for you. But it is not acceptable for me.

 

When you fail, you typically learn from your mistakes and get better from it. My lowest lows in life have led me to my highest highs, because I learned from my mistakes so I could become better.

 

What has Hennigan learned? How has he gotten better? This team is in the exact same spot it was in when he took over. We have not improved. We have not collected talent. We have just spun our wheels in the mud the entire time he's been here.

 

His failures have been in vain.

 

Be better.

 

Look, we both agree things went south after Skiles was brought in with the Tobias trade. Going away from the plan.

 

My thing is, that's as much if not more, on management. That's all. In the middle of all that, he kept our flexibility and got us Vogel who at the time was considered the catch of the day.

 

You choose to ignore managements role in the deviation from the plan.

 

Maybe you should be asking why doesn't management learn from their mistakes more so.

[Franchise408 116]

Look, we both agree things went south after Skiles was brought in with the Tobias trade. Going away from the plan.

 

My thing is, that's as much if not more, on management. That's all. In the middle of all that, he kept our flexibility and got us Vogel who at the time was considered the catch of the day.

 

You choose to ignore managements role in the deviation from the plan.

 

Maybe you should be asking why doesn't management learn from their mistakes more so.

 

Because before Hennigan came in, management was running a perpetually winning franchise.

 

Going away from Hennigan's plan wasn't the problem. Hennigan's plan in the first place was the problem.

[Magicman28 295]

Because before Hennigan came in, management was running a perpetually winning franchise.

 

Going away from Hennigan's plan wasn't the problem. Hennigan's plan in the first place was the problem.

 

What should've been planned then?