Is "really good" good enough?

[Catman 380]

Fair enough. Perhaps this belongs in another thread but what benchmarks would you set for the team next season to see if its making progress or not?

 

 

Really good question. We need to see players like Dipo/Harris/Harkless and Vuc stepping up big time. One or two of these guys needs to be in the all-star conversation.

 

The rookies need to show development over the season. Payton should be battling for the starting job by midseason and Gordon needs to show that he is developing his game so by April we see an uptick in shooting % and overall +/- .

 

We should be contending for the 8th spot. Obviously this is not a good scenario for drafting, but the tank mode is over. This team will be coached to win every night.

 

So this means JV needs to show improvement as a coach. His rotations need to be consistent, and he needs to utilize the speed and athleticism of this team properly.

 

If I see those things (which I believe I will), we are in very good shape to be a perennial playoff team moving forward.

[Franchise408 116]

Did you see a light at the end of the tunnel when we had GHill's contract, he wasn't playing, our team could not afford to sign any Free Agents and we lost Tmac for Houstons scrubs and bottomed out to the #1 pick?

 

Because this is a much better situation then that.

 

Tons of cap space, lots of young talent. Not sure how anyone can't see the light unless they are casual fans who need to see multiple stars on a team at all times to feel good about it's direction.

 

Rebuilding is a long process if you want a team that can sustain itself after the rebuild is over. Just how it is.

 

Yes, actually, I did. Hell, trading T-Mac and what we got in return gave me renewed hope. To this day I still see that as one of the best trades this franchise has made.

 

Because we actually bottomed out with T-Mac. It was T-Mac's last year that earned us the #1 pick.

 

We drafted Dwight Howard, and signed Hedo Turkoglu.

 

We immediately traded T-Mac, and the core of that cellar dwelling team to Houston, for Steve Francis, Cuttino Mobley, and Kelvin Cato, instantly upgrading our team.

 

Our team was instantly improved following the T-Mac trade than we were with T-Mac. And Steve Francis, Cuttino Mobley, and Kelvin Cato, were all the pieces that we used to eventually free up the cap space that brought in Rashard Lewis and put us over the top.

 

We had immediate playoff aspirations the moment we traded T-Mac away, and while it didn't happen for a couple years, we had instant hope, and consistent improvement.

 

The one thing we DIDN'T do was become perpetual cellar dwellers, which we currently are.

 

You're not remembering correctly if you think we got Houston's "scrubs", and that it was with Francis and Mobley that we bottomed out to the #1 pick. We bottomed out before they got here, and it was bringing them in that set us on the path to become contenders less than 5 seasons later.

[magicblue 315]

Yes, actually, I did. Hell, trading T-Mac and what we got in return gave me renewed hope. To this day I still see that as one of the best trades this franchise has made.

 

Because we actually bottomed out with T-Mac. It was T-Mac's last year that earned us the #1 pick.

 

We drafted Dwight Howard, and signed Hedo Turkoglu.

 

We immediately traded T-Mac, and the core of that cellar dwelling team to Houston, for Steve Francis, Cuttino Mobley, and Kelvin Cato, instantly upgrading our team.

Our team was instantly improved following the T-Mac trade than we were with T-Mac. And Steve Francis, Cuttino Mobley, and Kelvin Cato, were all the pieces that we used to eventually free up the cap space that brought in Rashard Lewis and put us over the top.

 

We had immediate playoff aspirations the moment we traded T-Mac away, and while it didn't happen for a couple years, we had instant hope, and consistent improvement.

 

The one thing we DIDN'T do was become perpetual cellar dwellers, which we currently are.

 

You're not remembering correctly if you think we got Houston's "scrubs", and that it was with Francis and Mobley that we bottomed out to the #1 pick. We bottomed out before they got here, and it was bringing them in that set us on the path to become contenders less than 5 seasons later.

 

You make it sound like T-Mac is the reason we were terrible and like we we're fortunate to dump him on Houston for Francis, Mobley, and Cato. You realize you're talking about one of the top three Magic players of all time and one of the best in the game at that time right? We took Houston's trade fodder, and Dwight was the love child of dumb luck and utter horribleness during the worst season I can remember as a Magic fan. There was no strategy there, we were simply terrible and got lucky to land the #1 to draft Dwight. Hell, our GM was a hockey guy!

 

Don't confuse luck with an actual plan, which we have now. If you don't believe me, imagine if we had landed the second pick and Emeka Okafor instead of the #1 and Dwight. I think people forget we are essentially 3 lucky ping pong balls away from being as irrelevant as Minnesota or Milwaukee over the past quarter century. The light at the end of that tunnel just got pretty dim huh?

[Catman 380]

Yes, actually, I did. Hell, trading T-Mac and what we got in return gave me renewed hope. To this day I still see that as one of the best trades this franchise has made.

 

Because we actually bottomed out with T-Mac. It was T-Mac's last year that earned us the #1 pick.

 

We drafted Dwight Howard, and signed Hedo Turkoglu.

 

We immediately traded T-Mac, and the core of that cellar dwelling team to Houston, for Steve Francis, Cuttino Mobley, and Kelvin Cato, instantly upgrading our team.

 

Our team was instantly improved following the T-Mac trade than we were with T-Mac. And Steve Francis, Cuttino Mobley, and Kelvin Cato, were all the pieces that we used to eventually free up the cap space that brought in Rashard Lewis and put us over the top.

 

We had immediate playoff aspirations the moment we traded T-Mac away, and while it didn't happen for a couple years, we had instant hope, and consistent improvement.

 

The one thing we DIDN'T do was become perpetual cellar dwellers, which we currently are.

 

You're not remembering correctly if you think we got Houston's "scrubs", and that it was with Francis and Mobley that we bottomed out to the #1 pick. We bottomed out before they got here, and it was bringing them in that set us on the path to become contenders less than 5 seasons later.

 

Trading Tmac for those 3 guys was a low point. It happened because we had to. We had no cap flexibility due to Grant Hill being injured and unable to play. Our team Doctors could not fix him even though he went to PHO and played injury free.

 

Taking Dwight Howard first was a gamble. Big time. He was as raw as Gordon is.

 

But now we have a guy who has similar growing pains a very high ceiling, surrounded by young talent with no cap inflexibility from guys like Rashard Lewis and somehow you don't see the light at the end of the tunnel.

 

The Rashard finals team was a go for broke move and once it failed, Otis was left swinging for home runs, which is how things fall apart very quickly and you enter cap hell.

 

I just don't get how you can't see the light here but you could back then when we had teams built for 2-3 year runs before collapsing.

 

Now and then I meet people who actually thought Weisbrod as GM was a good idea. It really disturbs me when that happens. He traded Mobely away for a guy who sucked and would make hidden signals to his wife in the stands all day. It was terrible.

[God Hates Otis Smith 153]

Yes, actually, I did. Hell, trading T-Mac and what we got in return gave me renewed hope. To this day I still see that as one of the best trades this franchise has made.

 

Because we actually bottomed out with T-Mac. It was T-Mac's last year that earned us the #1 pick.

 

We drafted Dwight Howard, and signed Hedo Turkoglu.

 

We immediately traded T-Mac, and the core of that cellar dwelling team to Houston, for Steve Francis, Cuttino Mobley, and Kelvin Cato, instantly upgrading our team.

 

Our team was instantly improved following the T-Mac trade than we were with T-Mac. And Steve Francis, Cuttino Mobley, and Kelvin Cato, were all the pieces that we used to eventually free up the cap space that brought in Rashard Lewis and put us over the top.

 

We had immediate playoff aspirations the moment we traded T-Mac away, and while it didn't happen for a couple years, we had instant hope, and consistent improvement.

 

The one thing we DIDN'T do was become perpetual cellar dwellers, which we currently are.

 

You're not remembering correctly if you think we got Houston's "scrubs", and that it was with Francis and Mobley that we bottomed out to the #1 pick. We bottomed out before they got here, and it was bringing them in that set us on the path to become contenders less than 5 seasons later.

the tmac trade was awful if we had moved tmac for futures instead we could have picked top 5 the next year and gotten a bunch of picks or young talent, plus cap flexibility

[Franchise408 116]

You make it sound like T-Mac is the reason we were terrible and like we we're fortunate to dump him on Houston for Francis, Mobley, and Cato. You realize you're talking about one of the top three Magic players of all time and one of the best in the game at that time right? We took Houston's trade fodder, and Dwight was the love child of dumb luck and utter horribleness during the worst season I can remember as a Magic fan. There was no strategy there, we were simply terrible and got lucky to land the #1 to draft Dwight. Hell, our GM was a hockey guy!

 

Don't confuse luck with an actual plan, which we have now. If you don't believe me, imagine if we had landed the second pick and Emeka Okafor instead of the #1 and Dwight. I think people forget we are essentially 3 lucky ping pong balls away from being as irrelevant as Minnesota or Milwaukee over the past quarter century. The light at the end of that tunnel just got pretty dim huh?

 

T-Mac wasn't the reason why we sucked, no. But T-Mac himself will admit that he gave up that year, and made it clear he wanted out.

 

To catman, you're right, Otis sucked the last couple years. I never denied that. I liked Otis pre-2010, but you're right, after our ECF exit in 2010, he started getting desperate and that's when **** hit the fan and got ugly. I haven't offered much support for the last couple years, I clearly stated that he suffered the last couple years, but somehow people keep implying that I'm supporting those moves.

 

When Otis got booted, I supported it. That chapter needed to come to an end.

 

Where the difference is, I don't begrudge Otis' entire tenure here, because he was putting together a good team, and DID put together a good team. That, and I'd rather see a GM that "swings for homeruns" than sits on his thumbs and does nothing.

 

Weisbrod as GM was pretty bad. I liked the T-Mac trade, but I hated the trade to bring in Doug Christie. I absolutely hated that guy, I hated that trade. But we ended up moving Francis and Cato for the final pieces necessary needed to get us Rashard, and put us over the top in the East. For that run, I'll always admire Otis, even if he ended on a bad note.

 

Why don't I have high hopes for THIS rebuild? Because we're not doing anything - by design. By design, we are signing and trading for a bunch of middle of the pack players, stocking up on a bunch of middle of the pack draft picks, and tanking out for high draft picks, and not participating heavily in free agency, in the hopes that somehow all these middle of the pack players and draft picks turn into a bunch of all-stars, because hey, San Antonio.

 

All the rhetoric coming from the front office right now I've heard in countless other failed rebuilds throughout all the different major professional sports.

 

Hey, maybe Oladipo, Gordon, and Payton will all turn into perennial all stars, and I can bite my tongue and eat my crow. That'd be awesome. I actually have high hopes for Oladipo. Don't know what to expect yet from Payton. But with Gordon, we essentially drafted a 3/4 with no offensive game - on the hopes that he'll develop an offensive game. And passed up on what was seen as a premiere back court player to do it.

 

I don't mind that we moved guys like Dwight (who forced our hand) and Redick (who was an upcoming free agent) for guys like Vucevic and Harris. But THOSE are the guys that we are attempting to build around. Those are the mid tier players we're bringing in, with all-star caliber hopes.

 

I've watched countless times where a rebuilding team tries to emulate another team's formula - and fails miserably. I'm hearing ad naseum that San Antonio is our model here - but we don't have the luxuries that San Antonio has and had. We don't have our injured David Robinson coming back at full strength after a year of sucking enough to get Tim Duncan. We don't have our "best ever at his position" in Tim Duncan to build around with the Tony Parker's and Manu Ginobili's so that a guy like Khawi Leonard can go off and get an NBA Finals MVP. But somehow, we're expecting San Antonio results???

 

A lot of my distrust in this rebuild has as much, or moreso to do with the current state of the league as well than it does anything the Magic are or aren't doing. With this current trend of superstars bolting for big markets, I don't see a superstar bolting for Central Florida. And please, spare me Kevin Durant. He's not coming here, even if he DOES leave OKC. I don't see the current state of the league as being one where teams like the Magic can attract big name free agent talent.

 

But, if you're expecting to become long term competitors with a core of Oladipo, Gordon, Payton, Vucevic, Harkless, and Harris... I've got a bridge to sell you.

 

This team CERTAINLY isn't going to compete this year, which is going to be 3 straight years of tanking / lottery. Ben Gordon and Channing Frye aren't the kinds of guys that are going to take us to the next level. Hell, this duo is a downgrade of the vet duo of Afflalo and Nelson that we just got rid of.

 

So yea, unless this front office is able to get off their ass and make something happen, I don't see this team drastically improving for quite awhile.

 

But hey... what's even the point of arguing? Hennigan can do no wrong around here, amirite?

[magicblue 315]

T-Mac wasn't the reason why we sucked, no. But T-Mac himself will admit that he gave up that year, and made it clear he wanted out.

 

To catman, you're right, Otis sucked the last couple years. I never denied that. I liked Otis pre-2010, but you're right, after our ECF exit in 2010, he started getting desperate and that's when **** hit the fan and got ugly. I haven't offered much support for the last couple years, I clearly stated that he suffered the last couple years, but somehow people keep implying that I'm supporting those moves.

 

When Otis got booted, I supported it. That chapter needed to come to an end.

 

Where the difference is, I don't begrudge Otis' entire tenure here, because he was putting together a good team, and DID put together a good team. That, and I'd rather see a GM that "swings for homeruns" than sits on his thumbs and does nothing.

 

Weisbrod as GM was pretty bad. I liked the T-Mac trade, but I hated the trade to bring in Doug Christie. I absolutely hated that guy, I hated that trade. But we ended up moving Francis and Cato for the final pieces necessary needed to get us Rashard, and put us over the top in the East. For that run, I'll always admire Otis, even if he ended on a bad note.

 

Why don't I have high hopes for THIS rebuild? Because we're not doing anything - by design. By design, we are signing and trading for a bunch of middle of the pack players, stocking up on a bunch of middle of the pack draft picks, and tanking out for high draft picks, and not participating heavily in free agency, in the hopes that somehow all these middle of the pack players and draft picks turn into a bunch of all-stars, because hey, San Antonio.

 

All the rhetoric coming from the front office right now I've heard in countless other failed rebuilds throughout all the different major professional sports.

 

Hey, maybe Oladipo, Gordon, and Payton will all turn into perennial all stars, and I can bite my tongue and eat my crow. That'd be awesome. I actually have high hopes for Oladipo. Don't know what to expect yet from Payton. But with Gordon, we essentially drafted a 3/4 with no offensive game - on the hopes that he'll develop an offensive game. And passed up on what was seen as a premiere back court player to do it.

 

I don't mind that we moved guys like Dwight (who forced our hand) and Redick (who was an upcoming free agent) for guys like Vucevic and Harris. But THOSE are the guys that we are attempting to build around. Those are the mid tier players we're bringing in, with all-star caliber hopes.

 

I've watched countless times where a rebuilding team tries to emulate another team's formula - and fails miserably. I'm hearing ad naseum that San Antonio is our model here - but we don't have the luxuries that San Antonio has and had. We don't have our injured David Robinson coming back at full strength after a year of sucking enough to get Tim Duncan. We don't have our "best ever at his position" in Tim Duncan to build around with the Tony Parker's and Manu Ginobili's so that a guy like Khawi Leonard can go off and get an NBA Finals MVP. But somehow, we're expecting San Antonio results???

 

A lot of my distrust in this rebuild has as much, or moreso to do with the current state of the league as well than it does anything the Magic are or aren't doing. With this current trend of superstars bolting for big markets, I don't see a superstar bolting for Central Florida. And please, spare me Kevin Durant. He's not coming here, even if he DOES leave OKC. I don't see the current state of the league as being one where teams like the Magic can attract big name free agent talent.

 

But, if you're expecting to become long term competitors with a core of Oladipo, Gordon, Payton, Vucevic, Harkless, and Harris... I've got a bridge to sell you.

 

This team CERTAINLY isn't going to compete this year, which is going to be 3 straight years of tanking / lottery. Ben Gordon and Channing Frye aren't the kinds of guys that are going to take us to the next level. Hell, this duo is a downgrade of the vet duo of Afflalo and Nelson that we just got rid of.

 

So yea, unless this front office is able to get off their ass and make something happen, I don't see this team drastically improving for quite awhile.

 

But hey... what's even the point of arguing? Hennigan can do no wrong around here, amirite?

 

Stop right there. Did the Lakers sign a big time FA this summer? Did NY add a major FA that wasn't Melo? Oh yeah your right, Lebron did leave for the bright lights and big city...of CLEVELAND, OHIO, the frickin' armpit of American cities. Please give any example of this trend you speak of, because unless I'm really dense I've witnessed no "superstar" FA heading to any big market, much less a trend of the sort. In fact, it seems to me you are casually implying a phenomenon is occurring that simply is not. Do your homework or come stronger.

 

Back to Otis, you can give him all the credit you want for building a competitive team around Dwight Howard, but tell me how far that plan gets if we select #2 in 2004 and have to settle for Emeka Okafor? And while you're at it, please lay out an alternative rebuilding plan to that which is occurring right now in Orlando given the picks we've been afforded and the benefit of hindsight. If you can strategize a plan that puts us in a better position than we're currently in I'd love to hear it.

[Franchise408 116]

Well I would have drafted Exum instead of Gordon for one.

 

But just because I don't necessarily have a better plan means I can't have an opinion on our rebuild? Well then, I'm glad to know that you never criticize a movie or a music album, unless you're able to get in there and do a better job. I mean, I'm sure you have an extensive Academy Award winning resume to tout everytime you have a criticism with a movie.

 

Oh, and since you're criticizing Otis so heavily... I'd love to see the list of championship teams you've assembled during your career as an NBA GM.

 

As far as what we would have done had we got Okafor instead of Howard, I have no clue, because that's not what happened. I'm sure Otis would have looked a lot better as a GM at the end of his tenure if Dwight Howard didn't want to leave, too. From what I remember, Charlotte wanted Okafor anyways and would have drafted him at #1. You don't seem to remember, but Dwight wasn't a consensus #1 pick. This wasn't the 2nd coming of LeBron James. Many experts felt that Okafor was the pick, as he was more NBA ready than Dwight the project.

 

If you think that LeBron going back to Cleveland WASN'T for marketing and PR, I have another bridge to sell you. You know where he didn't go? You know where wasn't even an option? Milwaukee. Portland. Minnesota. Orlando...

 

Melo is in New York in the first place because of "big market" syndrome. I don't know their exact cap situation, but I don't think they really have the space to go out and get big time free agents, with Melo, Amare, and the remnants of the mess Isiah left.

 

L.A. didn't get anybody big, because they are a trainwreck. But where did their top free agent loss sign with? Oh that's right... Chicago. And they did get Boozer.

 

Miami kept Wade and Bosh.

 

Name me one small market team that had a shot at any legitimate top free agents this year...

 

I think the best was Paul Pierce signing with Washington, and Vince Carter signing with Memphis. And Rudy Gay who re-upped in Sacramento.

 

Who was in the running for all the top name free agents?

 

LeBron - Miami, Lakers, Suns, Cavs - the biggest headline in all of sports

Wade - Miami, Chicago

Bosh - Miami, Houston

Melo - New York, Chicago, Miami, wherever LeBron went

Pau - Lakers, Chicago

Parsons - Houston, Dallas

Amare - New York

Kevin Love - OUT of Minnesota

 

Yup... lots of interest in small markets from the top level free agents there. We'll be having a Magic / Timberwolves NBA Finals in no time.

[magicblue 315]

Well I would have drafted Exum instead of Gordon for one.

 

But just because I don't necessarily have a better plan means I can't have an opinion on our rebuild? Well then, I'm glad to know that you never criticize a movie or a music album, unless you're able to get in there and do a better job. I mean, I'm sure you have an extensive Academy Award winning resume to tout everytime you have a criticism with a movie.

 

Oh, and since you're criticizing Otis so heavily... I'd love to see the list of championship teams you've assembled during your career as an NBA GM.

 

As far as what we would have done had we got Okafor instead of Howard, I have no clue, because that's not what happened. I'm sure Otis would have looked a lot better as a GM at the end of his tenure if Dwight Howard didn't want to leave, too. From what I remember, Charlotte wanted Okafor anyways and would have drafted him at #1. You don't seem to remember, but Dwight wasn't a consensus #1 pick. This wasn't the 2nd coming of LeBron James. Many experts felt that Okafor was the pick, as he was more NBA ready than Dwight the project.

 

If you think that LeBron going back to Cleveland WASN'T for marketing and PR, I have another bridge to sell you. You know where he didn't go? You know where wasn't even an option? Milwaukee. Portland. Minnesota. Orlando...

 

Melo is in New York in the first place because of "big market" syndrome. I don't know their exact cap situation, but I don't think they really have the space to go out and get big time free agents, with Melo, Amare, and the remnants of the mess Isiah left.

 

L.A. didn't get anybody big, because they are a trainwreck. But where did their top free agent loss sign with? Oh that's right... Chicago. And they did get Boozer.

 

Miami kept Wade and Bosh.

 

Name me one small market team that had a shot at any legitimate top free agents this year...

 

I think the best was Paul Pierce signing with Washington, and Vince Carter signing with Memphis. And Rudy Gay who re-upped in Sacramento.

 

Who was in the running for all the top name free agents?

 

LeBron - Miami, Lakers, Suns, Cavs - the biggest headline in all of sports

Wade - Miami, Chicago

Bosh - Miami, Houston

Melo - New York, Chicago, Miami, wherever LeBron went

Pau - Lakers, Chicago

Parsons - Houston, Dallas

Amare - New York

Kevin Love - OUT of Minnesota

 

Yup... lots of interest in small markets from the top level free agents there. We'll be having a Magic / Timberwolves NBA Finals in no time.

 

Wow, okay where to start? Ok first off let's get Otis out of the way. Otis didn't draft Dwight, that was Weisbrod, he inherited him. The bigger point is we obtained Dwight based purely on dumb luck, not as part of some brilliant rebuilding plan so the only real discussion should be execution afterwards, which Fran Vasquez can confirm was not ideal although Rashard Lewis' accountant would vehemently disagree.

 

To FA, I love how you changed 'big market', in the case of Lebron, to "marketing". Clever but not the same thing. Strike one. Also love how retaining a FA (Wade, Bosh, Melo, Amare) somehow equates to superstars running to big markets. Nice effort, but still a whiff. Strike two. Unfortunately none of the players you listed are superstars who actually left for big markets. The closest is Gasol to Chicago, but that's hardly a trend unfortunately for you and your argument. Swing and a miss, strike three.

 

As far as the wise guy GM bit I'm not the one complaining. You'd take Exum huh? So he's a PG in your eyes? No? Okay well where does that leave Dipo? Okay then who do you take at #12 over Payton because there's no way you draft Exum and Payton? If you want to ***** then at least lay out a complete scenario that is better moving forward, otherwise I recommend you suck it up and quit biting off more than you can chew.

[A Better DJ & Photographer 461]

. We don't have our "best ever at his position" in Tim Duncan to build around with the Tony Parker's and Manu Ginobili's so that a guy like Khawi Leonard can go off and get an NBA Finals MVP. But somehow, we're expecting San Antonio results???

 

 

 

Hey Franchise

Just for the heck of it look up what draft pick numbers Parker, Ginobili, and Leonard were

and let me know :D

[Franchero MVP 391]

Well I would have drafted Exum instead of Gordon for one.

 

 

But just because I don't necessarily have a better plan means I can't have an opinion on our rebuild?

 

Saying you can't have an opinion and saying your opinion is illogical are two very different things. So this is a straw-man at best.

 

If you think that LeBron going back to Cleveland WASN'T for marketing and PR, I have another bridge to sell you.

 

The fact that Lebron left Miami and went back to Cleveland proves that small towns can lure big stars. Heck, even the fact that Kevin Love is willing to go there for a chance to win rather than going to LA or NY says alot.

 

L.A. didn't get anybody big, because they are a trainwreck. But where did their top free agent loss sign with? Oh that's right... Chicago. And they did get Boozer.

 

Gasol went to Chicago because they have a team ready to compete in the playoffs. If he wanted a big market he would have stayed in LA.

 

Many people forget that Lebron didnt leave Cleveland just because he didn't want to be in a small market; he left because he wanted to win and going to Miami with his best friends, that he'd been planning with for years, was his best bet. He could have went to NY or LA or many other bigger markets than Miami.

 

Stars are starting to realize that winning is now a priority in an otherwise very competitive league. If we can set up a team that's a super star away from being a legit title contender, I think a big name FA would gladly come.

[Optimist Prime 197]

Exum showed that he is a project player with high upside. You can't be mad at drafting Gordon because he's a project that will take 2-3 years to really develop when you're suggesting the team should have drafted a project that will take 2-3 years to develop. And who would you take at 12 then? Saric, who won't be coming over for two more years? Don't complain that the draft pick won't be able to produce and then immediately suggest another guy who is just as likely to not be able to produce. If your concern is immediate impact, Payton was the choice to make at PG.

 

It's been two bad years, and one of those years was filled with terrible contracts. That first year was to clean house. The second year was to get lottery picks. This year is going to be about production. Oladipo earned the trust of the front office and coaching staff to be worthy of a starting spot. How can Payton, Oladipo, and Fournier develop if we have Jameer and Afflalo taking the bulk of the minutes? Oladipo will probably start the year at PG and move to SG as Payton develops. Jameer and Afflalo get in the way of that plan. How is Channing Frye not an upgrade to our PF rotation over the last two years?

 

How can you judge this upcoming season as a tanking/lottery season when training camp hasn't even started yet? You say there are no potential All-Stars on the roster, yet two of our young players just got invited to the USA Select team and could possibly earn a spot on the FIBA team next year.

 

We all just need to be patient and wait until at least December before making any major claims about this team, good or bad.