Optimist Prime 197 Report post Posted March 9, 2014 Varejao, though he never played a game in a Magic uniform Yeah, I also thought of Billups in that regard. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Optimist Prime 197 Report post Posted March 9, 2014 We traded Mike Miller early in his career, and two of his more productive years scoring wise came in Orlando. Also, Vince Carter's dropoff came from age. He started dropping off before the end of his Nets tenure too. Darko had some of his more productive play in Orlando too, he had 2 bpg back in 2006. Steve Francis was just a jerk off. Not that I'm agreeing with anyone's argument in this thread. But with the exception of Ben Wallace, I don't see any sort of botched development from the Magic with these guys. I think this franchise's track record with player development is decent, but their track record with management is awful. That's kind of my point. We can't blame the organization for outside factors affecting the play of guys that come through here. There's too much to take into account on a player by player basis. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Emory889 353 Report post Posted March 9, 2014 Again from my qoute: I have always believed that players on other teams with other coaches would excel more. Thats my view and has always been my view on sports, not just basketball. I have always looked at players and teams to see which one has all the right pieces to an ever changing puzzle. And then wonder about the talented players not doing so well on other teams. Would I say that team jacked up a player by playing in the wrong system with the wrong coaches... Sure, but only if that player was able to breakout and out perform his previous team. I'm glad I took the time to type out that post for you to completely ignore every point I made. I take it that by ignoring my request to tell me the name of the Magic employee that is the solely responsible for the success of Penny Hardaway, twice, that you are talking out of your a**. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
barnettej 263 Report post Posted March 9, 2014 Right, a 2 way street which would mean that the player contributes as much as the organization. This would also mean that the player, if put on a different organization would have just as good of a chance of reaching his potential unless that other organization was just really bad. The point you were arguing was that Orlando made Dwight, it's absurd to think that no other team would have drafted him based on potential and allowed him to develop by helping him harness his physical gifts and desire to improve. Orlando didn't make him. Agreed up to the drafting line. I don't think a Chatlotte Bobcats Dwight would of come anywhere close to a Orlando Magic Howard. Just looking at what both had during that time. I would even go as far as saying that Dwight would of left Charlotte after 4yrs. But since this didn't happen, what's the point of talking about it. Penny could of did what Emory has said, replicate his talent and get the same result as Orlando. But it didn't happen. What has happened is that each of those players I called out had thier best years in Orlando. And did not replicate their success with other teams. Dwight can change that in Houston, but he hasn't yet... Time will tell. Look at Chauncy Billups... The Pistons gave Billups everything he needed to be a champ. Celtics lost out, Magic lost out. I would say that Pistons made Billups, becuase they had what he needed and it produced a championship. Am I being literal on the "made" statement, good lord no. I would never say that a team makes a player without all the other stuff. There are variables out the yin yang that plays into it. Like the role players, the coaches, trainers, family, lifestyle changes, girlfriends, endorsements, weather (like a hurricane taking out NO, forcing a team to play home in another state), etc. Being made to me, is where a player finds a match that leads to great things, like AS votes, playoffs, national attention, etc. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
barnettej 263 Report post Posted March 9, 2014 Have I hijacked this thread yet, or do I still need more work...lol Just kidding. I love you guys, don't think I'm taking any of this as personal. And I hope that non of you guys are taking it personal, it's not my intentions. Except for Echo... lmao... I kid , I kid. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
God Hates Otis Smith 153 Report post Posted March 10, 2014 he's a fake...he still aint apologized to the fans and city, instead he's "forgiven" those who he deemed needed it....fake christian, fake person. he did the magic dirty and held this franchise hostage, he's going to get booed until he formally apologizes Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
God Hates Otis Smith 153 Report post Posted March 10, 2014 I'd never boo him. I'll readily admit that I'm in the Magic fan minority on this, but Dwight's legacy is that arena and the team remaining in Orlando. That can't be overlooked. And that was a pretty solid near decade with him. Lot of good times and good runs; that's all not just a negative to me. We'll be very lucky to get close to that level again over these next 10 years. Was it messy? Obviously. And both sides *****ed up in their own ways (the Magic's culpability in The Divorce is often glossed over). In the end it's a profession, and it's his life. Can't blame him from (finally) making a decision. you're wrong, the magic were willing to trade him, just not to brooklyn for all the trash they were offering. he opted in because he didn't want to go to LA or Houston at the deadline, then he has the gall to talk about loyalty after that, when all it was, was a ploy to eventually get to brooklyn. its too bad he never ended up there with billy kings **** show Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
