Time for Replacement

[Zara 74]

Stan had a very bad night against the bulls, and it's pathological homerism to be unable to call that.

 

Neither Dwight, nor Stan, is above the Team.

[Sabian Jackson 0]

See bolded^^^^

 

I've been thinking about this for a while myself, wondering why is it the players that Babir mentioned all do very well before coming to the Magic...Vince had a very successful season with the NJ Nets prior to being traded to the Magic....JRich, although I didn't follow him that much with the Bobcats and then the Suns, I heard that he was very good with those teams....but I did watch Glen Davis a lot when he played for the Celtics, his shots were money. He gave PFs on other teams fits defensively and offensively.

 

Why is it these players struggle immediately after being traded to the Magic. Some are never the same after they are moved to other teams.

 

*Disclaimer* - I am not campaigning to have SVG fired. I just don't understand what happens to good basketball players after being very good on other teams, struggle when playing with the Magic.

 

 

I think it would be hard to argue that Bass and Rashard immediately got worse. Shard scored slightly less points, but his role was not the same as it was in Seattle, however his other stats remained relatively consistent. He also had easily the most successful time of his career with us.

 

The numbers Bass put up remained relatively similar to the ones he put up in Dallas, and he hasn't been in Boston long enough to really give any real indication he's somehow immediately better. (You could also argue he is now playing with Rondo, who creates much more than Nelson can).

 

J Rich and Carter you could argue are declining as players anyway, so we acquired them at the wrong end of their careers. Plus Carters numbers reduced even more once he went to Phoenix. More evidence he was/is declining as a player. You could also argue playing at a lower tempo than Phoenix, and not having Steve Nash on your team would also reduce the effectiveness of J Rich.

 

Arenas has not been the same player he was a few seasons ago, and we pretty much gambled on that. Hard to really say he "immediately" became worse once he came to us. And Glen Davis has been with us for 8 games. Hardly a big enough sample to say he is also immediately a worse player.

[Marc Acres 3:16 418]

See bolded^^^^

 

I've been thinking about this for a while myself, wondering why is it the players that Babir mentioned all do very well before coming to the Magic...Vince had a very successful season with the NJ Nets prior to being traded to the Magic....JRich, although I didn't follow him that much with the Bobcats and then the Suns, I heard that he was very good with those teams....but I did watch Glen Davis a lot when he played for the Celtics, his shots were money. He gave PFs on other teams fits defensively and offensively.

 

Why is it these players struggle immediately after being traded to the Magic. Some are never the same after they are moved to other teams.

 

*Disclaimer* - I am not campaigning to have SVG fired. I just don't understand what happens to good basketball players after being very good on other teams, struggle when playing with the Magic.

 

How did JJ look when he first got here? Jameer got better, Dwight got better, Stan is the only coach that has made Hedo a useable player, Rashard was very effective under Stan, Ryan has gotten better every year under Stan, Gortat got better under Stan, Lamar Odom got better under Stan, Caron Butler got better under Stan, Wade grew very quickly as a player under Stan, that Miami team was a nightmare to play under Stan. Now Brendan Malone deserves praise for the big men as well but I would say that Stan does a hell of a job developing and getting the most out of his guys.

 

You must have only watched Davis play against us because he isn't a high percentage shooter which is why Bos feels they got the better end of the deal. The person that posted the original comment is going by numbers only and he is ignoring all of the other players that have done well under Stan.

[NittanyBuc 757]

I have been saying this for 2 Seasons now. SVG IS THE TONY DUNGY OF THE MAGIC!!!! He can win, without a doubt but he can't make us a championship team.

One of Dungy's teams got Gruden a ring

[Franchero MVP 391]

I don't think players overall regress under Stan at all. I just think his rotations suck. His ability to use match ups to our advantage went out the door with rafer after the finals.

[Babir_9 95]

How did JJ look when he first got here? Jameer got better, Dwight got better, Stan is the only coach that has made Hedo a useable player, Rashard was very effective under Stan, Ryan has gotten better every year under Stan, Gortat got better under Stan, Lamar Odom got better under Stan, Caron Butler got better under Stan, Wade grew very quickly as a player under Stan, that Miami team was a nightmare to play under Stan. Now Brendan Malone deserves praise for the big men as well but I would say that Stan does a hell of a job developing and getting the most out of his guys

 

It took 2 and a half seasons for Redick to get consistent playing time. Foyle was ahead of Gortat for the whole season and only in playoffs vs Raptors (Game 3) SVG finaly started playing Marcin over Foyle. He could use Gortat alongside Dwight but could not figure out how. Now Gortat is gone and we are playing undersized PFs at C. Jameer got better??? he is not a good PG! too many turnovers, can't push the ball, move the ball, play defense, poor decisions all game long (shooting long jumpers on the fast breaks for example), bad FG %. I will never understand why SVG keeps Nelson on defense on last possesions, like against Lakers and Hawks when Fisher and Crawford were shooting over him and getting wins for their teams. Rashard Lewis was career SF and we signed him for max contract to play PF??? Dwight could be much much much better if not SVG, first 2 seasons he was told only to rebound and run the floor. Dwight is developing very slow. Still too many turnovers, still can't consistently pass when double teamed, still awkward in the post vs good/smart players. Jason Richardson was playing great with Suns, vs Blazers, Lakers he had crazy games, scoring 30 plus, 40 plus points, was playing with confidence. With Orlando last season he was playing like 45 years old veteran.

 

His ability to use match ups to our advantage went out the door with rafer after the finals.

 

Moreover, he creates mismatches for his own team!!! He plays Jason Richardson at SF! Nelson-Redick backcourt is worst defensive guard combination. That stupid small ball team with Hedo at PF is terrible. We are up by 20-30 and still does not play Orton, Harper and others. Does not play Vafer who can actually attack the rim. His players do not play with discipline and effort. Howard openly critisised him numerous times. I wish we could get Adelman this summer...

[Marc Acres 3:16 418]

It took 2 and a half seasons for Redick to get consistent playing time. Foyle was ahead of Gortat for the whole season and only in playoffs vs Raptors (Game 3) SVG finaly started playing Marcin over Foyle. He could use Gortat alongside Dwight but could not figure out how. Now Gortat is gone and we are playing undersized PFs at C. Jameer got better??? he is not a good PG! too many turnovers, can't push the ball, move the ball, play defense, poor decisions all game long (shooting long jumpers on the fast breaks for example), bad FG %. I will never understand why SVG keeps Nelson on defense on last possesions, like against Lakers and Hawks when Fisher and Crawford were shooting over him and getting wins for their teams. Rashard Lewis was career SF and we signed him for max contract to play PF??? Dwight could be much much much better if not SVG, first 2 seasons he was told only to rebound and run the floor. Dwight is developing very slow. Still too many turnovers, still can't consistently pass when double teamed, still awkward in the post vs good/smart players. Jason Richardson was playing great with Suns, vs Blazers, Lakers he had crazy games, scoring 30 plus, 40 plus points, was playing with confidence. With Orlando last season he was playing like 45 years old veteran.

 

 

 

Moreover, he creates mismatches for his own team!!! He plays Jason Richardson at SF! Nelson-Redick backcourt is worst defensive guard combination. That stupid small ball team with Hedo at PF is terrible. We are up by 20-30 and still does not play Orton, Harper and others. Does not play Vafer who can actually attack the rim. His players do not play with discipline and effort. Howard openly critisised him numerous times. I wish we could get Adelman this summer...

 

There are so many stupid comments in here I don't know where to begin.

 

Stan should give guys playing time before they've earned it? JJ needed to work on his game so he didn't get playing time, he worked on his game and now he gets playing time so why would you just give it to him as soon as he got here? Was Marcin ready the minute he got here? No, so they worked with him till he was ready. Why didn't Stan play Marcin more mins at the 4? Because he had trouble guarding 4's that he had to chase around, so what was he supposed to do give him more of Dwight's mins? If you are going to complain about not having Gortat and no true backup center (which is the least of our issues) that blame falls on Otis.

 

Jameer has too many turnovers...where do you think he ranked last year among PG's in turnovers? #16. You know who was ahead of him? Tony Parker, Jrue Holiday, Devin Harris, Raymond Felton, Steph Curry, Derrick Rose, Rajon Rondo, Steve Nash, Deron Williams, John Wall, and Russell Westbrook. You know where he is so far this season? #21. Poor FG %? He has a career average of 45% from the field and 38% from 3. Last year he shot right around his career average at .446 good for 23rd in the league for all guards who was he ahead of? Derrick Rose, Mike Conley, Joe Johnson, Russell Westbrook, Rodney Stuckey, Deron Williams, Chauncey Billups, DJ Augustine, Tyreke Evans. Is he having a bad start this year? Yes over the past 7 games he has had a bad start, so has quite a few other guards, Deron Williams, Raymond Felton, John Wall, Brandon Jennings all shooting poorly to start this season. Lets say we ignore all of that who do you feel would be obtainable and better for the team? Please pay close attention to the obtainable part.

 

How did moving Rashard to PF and keeping Hedo at SF work out for us? How does Rashard at SF look right now?

 

Dwight is developing slowly?? LOL if you can't see his development then I don't know how to explain it to you. His first 2 seasons he was told to run and rebound, who was the coach his first 2 seasons? Have you checked out his stats from Stan's first year here? Who exactly is Dwight awkward in the post against? Jason Collins and Kendrick Perkins is that because they out skill or out smart him? It's because they push him off his spots, they out physical him. What should he do to fix that? He's been working on a jumper every year since I can remember, other than what the coaching staff has already done what are they supposed to do to force him to be a good shooter?

 

I honestly can't explain what the heck is going on with Richardson so I don't know what to tell you.

 

Stan uses that small ball lineup in specific instances and only for short stretches of time, if other lineups are not getting the desired result should Stan just stick with one specific lineup and not try anything else? That is the very thing that Brian Hill used to do which is part of what made him a terrible coach.

 

His players do not play with effort because we have too many guys who are not built that way. Again this is on Otis for giving Stan crap to work with adding Rick Adelman would do what exactly? The coach only looks as good as what he has to work with.

[30Assists 342]

If we could get Phil Jackson to replace him? Sure.

 

The benefit of someone like Phil, besides the obvious, is that players would come here to play with him. Like....GOOD players. I'd say that's the Magic's biggest problem now: even when he have room under the cap, you don't see the veteran role-player guys who know how to win flooding to our shores. Nope - all heading to Miami, Boston, etc.

[Berto 338]

Every time this team loses a game, everyone should be traded, and the coach should be thrown off a bridge. We get it.

[Ryan the Magic Fan 253]

Thread's like this remind me that the vast majority of central florida sports fans really are just absolute morons who have no clue about sports. At all. Thanks for the laugh guys.

[COLOMBIANO 118]

I say fire SVG and hire Billy Donovan. I mean the guy will never say no or change his mind right?

[Berto 338]

Thread's like this remind me that the vast majority of central florida sports fans really are just absolute morons who have no clue about sports. At all. Thanks for the laugh guys.

 

fixed.