kramerthesecond 15 Report post Posted January 16, 2012 so on a bad team he is averaging 7.6 asts...so if he had better shooters, inside players like Jameer then he would have even better stats, more asts, no? NO. if he played on a team where there were better offensive options, he'd have the ball in his hands less, and average less assists. playing with a great center means less dribbling, means less stats. can mean more efficiency in the form of open three pointers, as they are the more efficient shot than two point field goals, but jameer is, uncharacteristically, struggling from down town. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NittanyBuc 757 Report post Posted January 16, 2012 so on a bad team he is averaging 7.6 asts...so if he had better shooters, inside players like Jameer then he would have even better stats, more asts, no? I said "he is a larger component to their offense". If we didn't have another ballhandler on the floor like Hedo, Nelson's stats would be inflated, too Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Secretly Space Jesus 670 Report post Posted January 16, 2012 are you trying to say that for a PG it is better to play with a crappy PFs and Cs than with the dominant ones? No, just that it's easier to put up better stats. Which you'd know if you'd bother to do your homework. But you didn't. Because you'd rather be ignorant and argumentative than learn something. You're welcome to act like that, you just need to understand that it doesn't make you "right". It just makes you obnoxious. EDIT: Also, we were talking about centers, not "PFs and Cs". Those are two separate positions, and how they relate to point guard play is incredibly different. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NittanyBuc 757 Report post Posted January 16, 2012 No, just that it's easier to put up better stats. Which you'd know if you'd bother to do your homework. But you didn't. Because you'd rather be ignorant and argumentative than learn something. You're welcome to act like that, you just need to understand that it doesn't make you "right". It just makes you obnoxious. Ruthless and blunt :shard: Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KandiKane 136 Report post Posted January 16, 2012 Ruthless and blunt :shard: Just waiting now to see how hard I facepalm on a scale of 1 - 10 with the response that will come back. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jareck80 3 Report post Posted January 17, 2012 I think it's silly that people believe that our game wouldn't be better with a PG that pushes the ball. Our fast break ppg are embarrassing, particularly when we have a center who runs the floor as hard as he does. With a dominant center who plays pick and roll so well and a team full of jump shooters, assists should fall out of the sky for our PG... but oh wait... he's busy heaving up shots. Can you imagine Steve Nash running pick and roll with Dwight? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AcuWill 45 Report post Posted January 17, 2012 No, just that it's easier to put up better stats. Which you'd know if you'd bother to do your homework. But you didn't. Because you'd rather be ignorant and argumentative than learn something. You're welcome to act like that, you just need to understand that it doesn't make you "right". It just makes you obnoxious. EDIT: Also, we were talking about centers, not "PFs and Cs". Those are two separate positions, and how they relate to point guard play is incredibly different. DoM calling anyone obnoxious. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AcuWill 45 Report post Posted January 17, 2012 I think it's silly that people believe that our game wouldn't be better with a PG that pushes the ball. Our fast break ppg are embarrassing, particularly when we have a center who runs the floor as hard as he does. With a dominant center who plays pick and roll so well and a team full of jump shooters, assists should fall out of the sky for our PG... but oh wait... he's busy heaving up shots. Can you imagine Steve Nash running pick and roll with Dwight? I love it when people make comments like "Can you imagine 'insert NBA player who is one of best PG in last decade' playing with Dwight." CAN YOU IMAGINE DWIGHT PLAYING WITH THE HYBRID OF MAGIC JOHNSON, JOHN STOCKTON, AND OSCAR ROBINSON IN THEIR PRIMES???????? Jameil Neelson is the sux. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ibn Battuta 127 Report post Posted January 17, 2012 I think it's silly that people believe that our game wouldn't be better with a PG that pushes the ball. Our fast break ppg are embarrassing, particularly when we have a center who runs the floor as hard as he does. With a dominant center who plays pick and roll so well and a team full of jump shooters, assists should fall out of the sky for our PG... but oh wait... he's busy heaving up shots. Can you imagine Steve Nash running pick and roll with Dwight? i'll take our disciplined, half-court offense over "push the ball" play any day of the week. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Babir_9 95 Report post Posted January 17, 2012 No, just that it's easier to put up better stats. I will stay with my opinion that it is easier for a PG to get a better stats, especially assists with a better team mates. If a PG is averaging 7.6 asts per game on a bad team as you are saying (Jarret Jack) then he would have more on a better team... EDIT: Also, we were talking about centers, not "PFs and Cs". Those are two separate positions, and how they relate to point guard play is incredibly different. Yes, but you just said that it is "easier" to get stats for a PG on a bad team...so that includes every other position... Also I wrote Cs and PFs because there are not too many pure Cs left in the modern game... Now, from the memory, without checking, I would say that Tony Parker who spent most of his career playing with Tim Duncan had pretty good stats, no? Magic Johnson had a great career playing with Abdul Jabbar. Steve Nash had two MVPs when played with Amare Stoudemire. Penny Hardaway had great stats when played with Shaq. I can not believe that you are trying to prove that for the PG it is better to play (to get a better stats) on a bad team and with a weak inside players... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Optimist Prime 197 Report post Posted January 17, 2012 I will stay with my opinion that it is easier for a PG to get a better stats, especially assists with a better team mates. If a PG is averaging 7.6 asts per game on a bad team as you are saying (Jarret Jack) then he would have more on a better team... Yes, but you just said that it is "easier" to get stats for a PG on a bad team...so that includes every other position... Also I wrote Cs and PFs because there are not too many pure Cs left in the modern game... Now, from the memory, without checking, I would say that Tony Parker who spent most of his career playing with Tim Duncan had pretty good stats, no? Magic Johnson had a great career playing with Abdul Jabbar. Steve Nash had two MVPs when played with Amare Stoudemire. Penny Hardaway had great stats when played with Shaq. I can not believe that you are trying to prove that for the PG it is better to play (to get a better stats) on a bad team and with a weak inside players... Parker and Jameer have very similar career stats in all categories except ppg because of the volume that Parker shot until Jameer's injury. There is a noticeable drop off after that point in Jameer's career. Let's not forget he got hurt earlier this season as well, a neck strain that was aggravated the game he came back. So, I don't know how that may have effected his development. In all, he is in a bit of a slump, but still moving and has had a couple of games with great energy and pace. But, he has been playing off the ball with Hedo as the facilitator on offense, so I'm actually not sure that a true pg would help our system quite as much as you are assuming it would. As per the rest of the guys on your list, Shaq's best years were in LA with Derek Fisher at point. Amare is NOT in any way one of the most dominant big men now, let alone all time. And I can give you Magic, but to be fair, he was also able to win the 1980 NBA finals by playing every position on the court WITHOUT Kareem. Also, Kareem's best years were arguably behind him by that point. Anyways, I think PGs get stat buffers on bad teams because they end up being they guy making all the plays and getting shots for their teammates, who can't do it on their own. On better teams, your guys are able to create their own shot and take guys off the dribble or make the extra pass, thus taking the stats away from the PG. Though, that's what they SHOULD do. Look at the jump Deron's stats took after going to NJ last season. It work for bigs, too. I doubt KLove gets such superstats on a team that can actually win games, because they won't rely on him so much to do, well, everything. Just my .02 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kramerthesecond 15 Report post Posted January 17, 2012 I think it's silly that people believe that our game wouldn't be better with a PG that pushes the ball. Our fast break ppg are embarrassing, particularly when we have a center who runs the floor as hard as he does. With a dominant center who plays pick and roll so well and a team full of jump shooters, assists should fall out of the sky for our PG... but oh wait... he's busy heaving up shots. Can you imagine Steve Nash running pick and roll with Dwight? can't say i agree because the game ALWAYS slows waaaay down in the playoffs. i think that getting easy points is fools gold, in that, i'd rather see our halfcourt offense have as many reps as possible throughout the regular season because running the playoffs just doesn't happen. nobody tries anywhere near as hard getting back in december as they do in may and with the level of athletes, fast breaks just don't really happen in the playoffs and they are definitely not something you want your team to lean on for production. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
