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?4thewin

2017-2018 Official Season Discussion Thread

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Mike1989    54
6 minutes ago, ML6 said:

Is there a need to trade Gordon or Isaac?  I'm missing the boat here.  They can easily be on the court at the same time.

They can if Isaac's best position is SF and not PF. If he's better suited to PF duties and considered to have more upside, then trading Gordon to get another pick or talent to upgrade a different position (e.g. PG) could be an option.

Also, it depends how they want this team to play. Do they want to play with a similar style to what we've been doing without Gordon and Vucevic, ie prioritising ball and player movement and shooting? Or do we want to try and smother teams with defense and play that grit and grind style? That could be a factor since we might want to use Isaac at PF, with Fournier, Hezonja (if he's extended) or Doncic (if we draft him) since that would give us a number of shooters and capable ball handlers. Flip side is if we add Bamba to Gordon and Isaac, that gives us a front court with a lot of defensive potential. 

Another factor could be whether they want to invest max money in Gordon. He's improved a lot this season but remains injury prone. If we pay big money to him and he remains injury prone that could make him difficult to trade later on. So his injury record needs consideration, can he overcome his injuries and play a full season? Or will his durability always be a question mark? If it's the former, extend him. If it's the latter, take calls to see what you can get and decide which has more value, the trade package or extending and sticking with Gordon.

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Ibn Battuta    123
32 minutes ago, ML6 said:

Is there a need to trade Gordon or Isaac?  I'm missing the boat here.  They can easily be on the court at the same time.

well not really. Isaac best position is probably PF. We already know Gordon at SF is a fail. Maybe you can get away with Gordon at the 5 since the league is going small. 

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ML6    249
1 minute ago, Mike1989 said:

They can if Isaac's best position is SF and not PF. If he's better suited to PF duties and considered to have more upside, then trading Gordon to get another pick or talent to upgrade a different position (e.g. PG) could be an option.

Also, it depends how they want this team to play. Do they want to play with a similar style to what we've been doing without Gordon and Vucevic, ie prioritising ball and player movement and shooting? Or do we want to try and smother teams with defense and play that grit and grind style? That could be a factor since we might want to use Isaac at PF, with Fournier, Hezonja (if he's extended) or Doncic (if we draft him) since that would give us a number of shooters and capable ball handlers. Flip side is if we add Bamba to Gordon and Isaac, that gives us a front court with a lot of defensive potential. 

Another factor could be whether they want to invest max money in Gordon. He's improved a lot this season but remains injury prone. If we pay big money to him and he remains injury prone that could make him difficult to trade later on. So his injury record needs consideration, can he overcome his injuries and play a full season? Or will his durability always be a question mark? If it's the former, extend him. If it's the latter, take calls to see what you can get and decide which has more value, the trade package or extending and sticking with Gordon.

Eh, positions aren't that important anymore.  Are they versatile and capable of switching?  Yes to both.  They can play together.

I think we know WeltHam's playstyle based on track record -- length and versatility.  Do Gordon and Isaac have those?  Yes to both.  They can play together.

Gordon played 78 and 80 games in the past 2 seasons.  It is too early to say he is injury prone. 

It just doesn't make sense to entertain trading either of these guys right now.  People lament that the rebuild has taken too long but then get pissed when we're not patient.  The team gave up on Oladipo too early and we're seeing now that they gave up on Hezonja too early.  So now we're going to go and entertain prematurely trading two of the youngest players on the team who also have the highest upsides?  So that we can take another chance on a draft pick that may never end up being as good?  When does that perpetual cycle end, then?  Can't we just see what we have first?

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?4thewin    1,750
12 minutes ago, Ibn Battuta said:

well not really. Isaac best position is probably PF. We already know Gordon at SF is a fail. Maybe you can get away with Gordon at the 5 since the league is going small. 

I think if Gordon shot the ball last season like he is this season he'd be fine at 3

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ML6    249

TBH an Isaac-Gordon-JJJ frontline has me salivating from a defensive standpoint.  Offensive development would be key.

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ML6    249
4 minutes ago, magicblue said:

Jordan wasn't

Yes, I covered that in my subsequent posts.

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Mike1989    54
48 minutes ago, ML6 said:

TBH an Isaac-Gordon-JJJ frontline has me salivating from a defensive standpoint.  Offensive development would be key.

In today's NBA it would be interesting to see if we could have success with a high calibre defense with acceptable offensive production. It's going a bit against the grain but it would be interesting to see how it holds up.

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Mike1989    54
1 hour ago, ML6 said:

It just doesn't make sense to entertain trading either of these guys right now.  People lament that the rebuild has taken too long but then get pissed when we're not patient.  The team gave up on Oladipo too early and we're seeing now that they gave up on Hezonja too early.  So now we're going to go and entertain prematurely trading two of the youngest players on the team who also have the highest upsides?  So that we can take another chance on a draft pick that may never end up being as good?  When does that perpetual cycle end, then?  Can't we just see what we have first?

I do agree that we shouldn't give up on our young talent, but this is a new front office and depending on how they evaluate these players they might decide to extend them and bank on them doing an Oladipo or they might move on from them and go with new talent in the hope that they are the answer to our rebuild rather than those we move on from.

Regarding the cycle, does extending Gordon and Hezonja give us a better chance of ending that cycle than moving on from them? It's debatable because for the cycle to end Gordon and Hezonja need to realize their potential, and if they don't, we are stuck with those deals and potentially in a similar position to Charlotte without Kemba Walker (ie little to no cap space, not bad enough for a top pick or good enough for the play offs). But if they do the cycle might end. It's a tough position to be in and I don't envy our front office's position on this one because there's no risk free path.

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Murphy13    166
1 hour ago, Ibn Battuta said:

well not really. Isaac best position is probably PF. We already know Gordon at SF is a fail. Maybe you can get away with Gordon at the 5 since the league is going small. 

If you take a look at the leagues biggest young stars they are mostly bigs.  The league is not going small, it’s going more diverse, fast, etc but not small.

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magicdoc1    165

Will you trade Leonard for Biz, Gordon our 2019 first round pick and the phoenix 2018 second roundpick? 

I am not sure what is going on with Leonard and Popovich but they are clearly not in terms. Maybe is their relationship or maybe is the injury but it seems as they are not happy with Leoanrd at the moment. 

Maybe we can create a package to entice them. The downside is that Leonard will be an unrestrictive free agent in 2020. 

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Irelando    1
1 hour ago, Mike1989 said:

In today's NBA it would be interesting to see if we could have success with a high calibre defense with acceptable offensive production. It's going a bit against the grain but it would be interesting to see how it holds up.

I think you can. Boston has a similar offensive rating to us..

 

Would love the JJJ, AG, Isaac combo. We'd have no long term point guard which could hurt their development but they'd all individually have lots of offensive potential

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