Is It Time for Rob to Go?

[Justin Jaudon 221]

Nah. You're just being myopic

 

I hope so.

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

I hope so.

 

I mean this might be a colossal failure but if the ultimate result of this is just a restart then that's just a ****ty waste of 4 years.

 

Not just grant hill but perpetual bad drafting and bad roster management wasting mcgrady will always be a much bigger problem.

[Magicman28 295]

lol It wouldn't be great but it might get rid of the Jeff Green Starting / 'Pimp My Aaron Gordon into Paul George' thing that seems to be one of the major factors of our suckage.

 

Speaking of Paul George, if they're committed to that premise could Rudy Gay then become our Danny Granger to Gordon's George?

 

Not that I want to be the Pacers... like, ever.

 

 

I can get rid of that real quick without getting Rudy.

[Justin Jaudon 221]

I mean this might be a colossal failure but if the ultimate result of this is just a restart then that's just a ****ty waste of 4 years.

 

Not just grant hill but perpetual bad drafting and bad roster management wasting mcgrady will always be a much bigger problem.

 

I don't know what to think of this team's drafting before Henny. On the one hand, we got Shaq and Dwight, clear first picks, so no real great decisions there, just not screwing the pooch. But on the other hand, we got Penny, a great draft trade that got us basically equal if not potentially better talent plus a bunch more draft picks, Mike Miller, a ROTY and a good player, Jameer, a really good late pick, and JJ, a really solid mid-first pick, and Courtney Lee, another good late first rounder. On the other hand, nearly every other pick before Henny has been a disaster at least as bad as Elfrid Payton, from Bison Dele/Brian Williams to Johnny Taylor to Steven Hunter to Curtis Borchardt to the colossal *****-ups that were Reese Gaines and Fran. It has been bad, to be sure. But part of that is the relatively consistent success of the team, leading to at best mid-first round picks.

 

Roster management has been a plague, yes, but it too has spanned multiple management groups. Wasting McGrady, again, has to be at least half chalked up to really bad luck. The organization couldn't build a viable team around McGrady because of Hill's albatross contract. Building a team around McGrady and Hill might have gone completely differently, because they would have needed less help and other vets might have been more willing to sign here. I just can't blame the Hill situation on bad decision-making, because his injury was such a strange situation. And at least half of the problems that roster had were directly related to that problem. The other half, that's on management, which makes the situation bad, but not, I think, as bad as wasting a rebuild during which guys like Giannis, Wiggins, Embiid, KAT, Russell, Okafor, and Porzingis were likely building-block type players. Hell, forgetting guys he didn't actually have a chance to draft - because he didn't win at sucking, and lottery balls suck - if we could have come away with one of Giannis, LaVine, Hood, Turner, or Booker, I'd be in a much better mood. Instead, we drafted a grand total of 1 guy who MIGHT end up a starter for this team long-term. ugh...

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

I don't know what to think of this team's drafting before Henny. On the one hand, we got Shaq and Dwight, clear first picks, so no real great decisions there, just not screwing the pooch. But on the other hand, we got Penny, a great draft trade that got us basically equal if not potentially better talent plus a bunch more draft picks, Mike Miller, a ROTY and a good player, Jameer, a really good late pick, and JJ, a really solid mid-first pick, and Courtney Lee, another good late first rounder. On the other hand, nearly every other pick before Henny has been a disaster at least as bad as Elfrid Payton, from Bison Dele/Brian Williams to Johnny Taylor to Steven Hunter to Curtis Borchardt to the colossal *****-ups that were Reese Gaines and Fran. It has been bad, to be sure. But part of that is the relevantly consistent success of the team, leading to at best mid-first round picks.

 

Roster management was been a plague, yes, but it too has spanned multiple management groups. Wasting McGrady, again, has to be at least half chalked up to really bad luck. The organization couldn't build a viable team around McGrady because of Hill's albatross contract. Building a team around McGrady and Hill might have gone completely differently, because they would have needed less help and other vets might have been more willing to sign here. I just can't blame the Hill situation on bad decision-making, because his injury was such a strange situation. And at least half of the problems that roster had were directly related to that problem. The other half, that's on management, which makes the situation bad, but not, I think, as bad as wasting a rebuild during which guys like Giannis, Wiggins, Embiid, KAT, Russell, Okafor, and Porzingis were likely building-block type players. Hell, forgetting guys he didn't actually have a chance to draft - because he didn't win at sucking, and lottery balls suck - if we could have come away with one of Giannis, LaVine, Hood, Turner, or Booker, I'd be in a much better mood. Instead, we drafted a grand total of 1 guy who MIGHT end up a starter for this team long-term. ugh...

 

I mean a lot of it is bad luck. We start the rebuild one year later and we're getting Jabari, porzingis, booker or maybe cameron Payne, and Dunn. We start one year earlier and it's even worse.

 

But don't lose hope yet. There's still a good team in this team. Just need to figure things out. Maybe meeks is enough to boost our offense now that we seemed to figure out the defense

[Justin Jaudon 221]

I mean a lot of it is bad luck. We start the rebuild one year later and we're getting Jabari, porzingis, booker or maybe cameron Payne, and Dunn. We start one year earlier and it's even worse.

 

But don't lose hope yet. There's still a good team in this team. Just need to figure things out. Maybe meeks is enough to boost our offense now that we seemed to figure out the defense

 

I get the bad luck thing, I do. But it seems like even if we didn't get more than one of those guys we missed on, we should have found one good starter in now 4 years of picking in the lottery. I suppose we did, as Oladipo is a good starter on virtually any team in the NBA, even if he's not a star, and we traded him for an older version of him at a more needed position (defensive-minded guy who can contribute on both sides of the ball, but is not really a guy you should rely too much on as a scorer). But that still leaves us with 4 lottery picks (I still think adding in our pick this year for Ibaka was Henny getting fleeced like with Payton) and not one guaranteed starter - I mean, Payton is a guaranteed starter, but only because he is Henny's illegitimate child or something. That's bad, man.

[Magicman28 295]

I mean a lot of it is bad luck. We start the rebuild one year later and we're getting Jabari, porzingis, booker or maybe cameron Payne, and Dunn. We start one year earlier and it's even worse.

 

But don't lose hope yet. There's still a good team in this team. Just need to figure things out. Maybe meeks is enough to boost our offense now that we seemed to figure out the defense

 

 

Meeks? Really?

 

Figure what out? It's simple. Green as your starting SF is an disaster.

[South_Aussie_Magic 90]

I mean this might be a colossal failure but if the ultimate result of this is just a restart then that's just a ****ty waste of 4 years.

 

Not just grant hill but perpetual bad drafting and bad roster management wasting mcgrady will always be a much bigger problem.

 

Exactly, this might be the nostalgia of my teenage years rearing its head but that mess took a boatload of time to get out from under. And there had to at least have been some concern that Hill was going to collapse into a heap.

 

Not really playing the Otis / Hennigan game just we've endured some **** as a fan base and I'm kinda glad that while we haven't had players pan out we don't have to say "who the ***** is Jeryl Sasser / Ryan Humphrey / Steven Hunter / Reece Gaines / Curtis Borchardt" 'cause nothing escapes all that bad drafting.

[South_Aussie_Magic 90]

I get the bad luck thing, I do. But it seems like even if we didn't get more than one of those guys we missed on, we should have found one good starter in now 4 years of picking in the lottery. I suppose we did, as Oladipo is a good starter on virtually any team in the NBA, even if he's not a star, and we traded him for an older version of him at a more needed position (defensive-minded guy who can contribute on both sides of the ball, but is not really a guy you should rely too much on as a scorer). But that still leaves us with 4 lottery picks (I still think adding in our pick this year for Ibaka was Henny getting fleeced like with Payton) and not one guaranteed starter - I mean, Payton is a guaranteed starter, but only because he is Henny's illegitimate child or something. That's bad, man.

 

I still get sad over Vic even if it might have been for the best. Not saying it has been yet, but it might.

 

I'm not ready to give up on Payton but his strengths and weaknesses aren't great. But he's 22, isn't there still time for hope?

[Justin Jaudon 221]

But he's 22, isn't there still time for hope?

 

About 10 games worth of time. :dustball:

[Justin Jaudon 221]

I mean a lot of it is bad luck. We start the rebuild one year later and we're getting Jabari, porzingis, booker or maybe cameron Payne, and Dunn. We start one year earlier and it's even worse.

 

Also, Who's to say we draft Jabari, Porzingis, Booker/Payne, and Dunn a year later. In '14, it's likely we pick Jabari, sure. But Henny reached for Gordon at 4, maybe he would have at 2. It's hard to say. We went safe year 1, though, so Jabari is likely. Year 2, I think we all know he would have picked Porz at 4. He clearly wanted him to last till 5, and saw Mario as a consolation prize (what contest in hell did we win?!). But we were all pretty sure he'd go Exum and he went Gordon year 2, so anything is possible. Also, I think Payne is more likely than Booker for the second lottery pick, because PG project with solid defense. Year 3, in this scenario, the comparison is more like him going for Thon Maker at five, a possibly redundant talent with a dubious resume, but a lot of raw potential he may never learn to use.

 

So hindsight says sure, if we had started a year later, we would have gotten Jabari, Porz, Payne/Booker, and maybe Dunn. But we could also have gotten Gordon, Cauley-Stein, Rozier, and Thon Maker. ugh

[Justin Jaudon 221]

I mean a lot of it is bad luck. We start the rebuild one year later and we're getting Jabari, porzingis, booker or maybe cameron Payne, and Dunn. We start one year earlier and it's even worse.

 

And starting one year earlier, maybe we don't do worse. Maybe we go Lillard (upper-classman like Dipo, safe pick), Noel, (young project who projects to be a superior defender, like Gordon), Steven Adams (actual 12th pick) or trade for McCollum (small-school guy who put up big numbers, picked at 10, like Elf), and then Exum (redundant talent, somewhat unknown commodity, like Mario.

 

Or maybe instead of Lillard, Beal (two-way guard like Dipo); and maybe instead of Exum, Gordon (since we reached on him by most standards, anyway).

 

This game is fun. :happypuppy: