Miller4Prez66 545 Report post Posted July 10, 2016 I hate Skiles more than anyone here probably but I think Jennings and Ilyasova were gone regardless of who the coach was going to be. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fultz4thewin 2,464 Report post Posted July 10, 2016 I hate Skiles more than anyone here probably but I think Jennings and Ilyasova were gone regardless of who the coach was going to be. Wouldn't be surprised if this was why Skiles quit. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Justin Jaudon 221 Report post Posted July 10, 2016 The Skiles hate on here is totally justified, but also hilariously naive. As a person, Skiles earned the hate by quitting. But, objectively, by any sane measure, he did a good job actually coaching the team. Did we luck into a better coach? Sure, most likely we did. But using him as a scapegoat now for all the team's failures is naive. Mario was not a good player last year. Skiles didn't play guys who weren't performing because we were trying to win. And we did get a ten win increase. People need to stop blaming Skiles for everything, most notably Payton and Mario. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fultz4thewin 2,464 Report post Posted July 10, 2016 The Skiles hate on here is totally justified, but also hilariously naive. As a person, Skiles earned the hate by quitting. But, objectively, by any sane measure, he did a good job actually coaching the team. Did we luck into a better coach? Sure, most likely we did. But using him as a scapegoat now for all the team's failures is naive. Mario was not a good player last year. Skiles didn't play guys who weren't performing because we were trying to win. And we did get a ten win increase. People need to stop blaming Skiles for everything, most notably Payton and Mario. Eh, his rotations were weird and his own passion for the job can be considered at least somewhat responsible for the mid season collapse. He didn't play Hezonja and Payton a lot. But he also didn't play Gordon for stretches too. All in all he was a league average coach that may or may not have hurt the development of a couple players. However, the mandate was win and sometimes development takes a backseat to winning. Glad we now have a coach that does both. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Justin Jaudon 221 Report post Posted July 10, 2016 Eh, his rotations were weird and his own passion for the job can be considered at least somewhat responsible for the mid season collapse. He didn't play Hezonja and Payton a lot. But he also didn't play Gordon for stretches too. All in all he was a league average coach that may or may not have hurt the development of a couple players. However, the mandate was win and sometimes development takes a backseat to winning. Glad we now have a coach that does both. It seems more likely to me the midseason collapse was somewhat responsible for his disillusionment with the job (but his disillusionment may have lengthened it, I suppose). And after Gordon earned the job, he played Gordon plenty. We can disagree with specific instances when he pulled Gordon for stretches, but overall Gordon got plenty of minutes. Like you said, development can take a back seat to winning, and when Skiles was asked to develop basically an entire team, it pretty much put him in the position of win games or piss off fans for not playing the young guys who aren't ready yet. He had to develop guys in practice, which players and fans both hate. The good thing for Vogel is that he's coming in at the perfect time. We're no longer a team that needs to develop half a dozen players, only two or three, and for all but one of those guys we have other options. All the people who think Skiles left because he wanted to become a more veteran team rather than develop guys, look at this off-season. Clearly, the plan was to do exactly that. I have my suspicions of why Skiles didn't get along with Hennigan, but the idea that he wanted to keep Ilyasova and Jennings is laughable, considering the minutes those guys got last year while on the team. Honestly, it doesn't bother me that people dislike Skiles. He quit on the team, so I don't like him either. But I hate to see people using him as a scapegoat for every problem this team has, because it distracts from looking objectively at the direction the team is going. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fultz4thewin 2,464 Report post Posted July 10, 2016 It seems more likely to me the midseason collapse was somewhat responsible for his disillusionment with the job (but his disillusionment may have lengthened it, I suppose). And after Gordon earned the job, he played Gordon plenty. We can disagree with specific instances when he pulled Gordon for stretches, but overall Gordon got plenty of minutes. Like you said, development can take a back seat to winning, and when Skiles was asked to develop basically an entire team, it pretty much put him in the position of win games or piss off fans for not playing the young guys who aren't ready yet. He had to develop guys in practice, which players and fans both hate. The good thing for Vogel is that he's coming in at the perfect time. We're no longer a team that needs to develop half a dozen players, only two or three, and for all but one of those guys we have other options. All the people who think Skiles left because he wanted to become a more veteran team rather than develop guys, look at this off-season. Clearly, the plan was to do exactly that. I have my suspicions of why Skiles didn't get along with Hennigan, but the idea that he wanted to keep Ilyasova and Jennings is laughable, considering the minutes those guys got last year while on the team. Honestly, it doesn't bother me that people dislike Skiles. He quit on the team, so I don't like him either. But I hate to see people using him as a scapegoat for every problem this team has, because it distracts from looking objectively at the direction the team is going. There were many times where it felt like "Skiles guys" could make mistakes and not be held to the same standards as other players who would make one mistake and then get pulled almost immediately. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Justin Jaudon 221 Report post Posted July 10, 2016 There were many times where it felt like "Skiles guys" could make mistakes and not be held to the same standards as other players who would make one mistake and then get pulled almost immediately. meh, I never got that impression. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CTMagicUK 1,483 Report post Posted July 10, 2016 You know whats fun? Putting our guys into 538's CARMELO, looking at the players on the similarity scores and getting excited imagining they all reach the best case. Elfrid Payton = Deron Williams/Mike Conley Evan Fournier = Reggie Miller/Klay Thompson Mario Hezonja = Paul George Aaron Gordon = Anthony Davis Biyombo = Deandre Jordan/Tyson Chandler If you completely ignore that that will never happen and that some of these similarities are only like 30% similarity to the guys rookie year it's really exciting and fun. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CTMagicUK 1,483 Report post Posted July 10, 2016 Mauro will be partying tonight. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fultz4thewin 2,464 Report post Posted July 10, 2016 Mauro will be partying tonight. He might not survive. Too much partying in a short timeframe Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Soul Bro 1,419 Report post Posted July 10, 2016 Blazers match Crabbe deal. These are crazy times. Vooch might have a top five value contract in the NBA Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fultz4thewin 2,464 Report post Posted July 10, 2016 Blazers match Crabbe deal. These are crazy times. Vooch might have a top five value contract in the NBA Such shortsighted deals. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
