Official 2015 Offseason Thread

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

I kind of agree with both of you to an extent.

 

Frye is overpaid, but that is the only way we were going to get him and logistically it made sense to get a stretch 4 since we failed in getting Patterson. Will that number be less under the new CBA? Sure. But still he was overpaid and I don't think it was a great signing. I don't think Rob thought him and Vuch would be that terrible defensively together.

 

BUT

 

I do think Frye can be a nice role player on this team, especially with a coach that utilizes his game. Ask Elfrid Payton how much nice life was in the lane when Frye was in the game vs Dedmon or whoever. Spacing was much different when Frye was on the court and Payton and Victor had more lanes to penetrate/drive in. Frye and Vuch can't play together, but Frye is a nice weapon to have on your bench. He's the kind of guy that can really help a second unit and I think he will have a better year next season than he did this year. I mean JV was literally trying to run the offense through Frye early in the year, even trying to post him up every game and that's just not how you utilize a player like Frye.

 

What would really be interesting is if we could get towns. I think playing him and Frye together might yield interesting results

[Catman 380]

Except your argument last year was that Frye would make the shooters around him better, now you're argument is that he needs better shooters around him to make HIM better. I mentioned last year, even transcribed a podcast from Zach Lowe talking about this, that we didn't have the type of guards Phoenix did and couldn't realistically expect similar results. Again, you mocked this. This is why I mentioned your comment earlier about how Frye will open things up for our shooters. Now you're claiming we don't have reliable shooters around him, what has changed? Nothing. You knew we didn't have the type of shooters Phoenix did when you made your initial claims, don't attempt to use something you argued against just last year as your new argument. You're all over the place with this one which is out of necessity because what you claimed last year was nonsense and it has now been proven. Spin mode is all that's left.

 

Actually I said he would help our spacing. But we can't actually force a player to make the shot. You are aware that Frye doesn't have magic powers, correct? Our spacing was better with Frye in the game this season. I'm not all over the place at all.

 

I guess you assumed this would all happen overnight - is that way you keep referencing this season even though the rebuild isn't complete? The Magic signed him to a 4 year deal for a reason.

[Franchero MVP 391]

Well since Kahwi won DPOY, pretty safe to say Spurs gonna offer everything to keep him.

[Catman 380]

Right, you said he'd help our spacing. I pointed out that this wouldn't matter if we don't have guards who can make the shot.

 

This is too funny, you've now resorted to using my own arguments from a year ago as if they were your own in an attempt to prove how you weren't wrong by arguing against these very same arguments.

 

Frye has been in the league for awhile now, if you want to take issue with my predictions about Gordon, fine, but when it comes to Frye I think it's absurd for you to hide behind this "we have three years left" argument as if Frye is going to suddenly turn into something other than the one dimensional role player he has been his entire career.

 

As I said last year, we already had a guy, Harris, on the roster who could potentially bring what Rob thought Frye would bring. This ended up being true, he may not hit three's at the same percentage (yet), but he showed he is capable of stretching the floor nearly as well. He's also better than Frye in virtually every other area of the game and is much younger. We didn't need Frye then and we don't need him going forward.

 

Actually it's not true. Harris is not shooting 39% from 3. He is not a true PF and is not 7 feet tall. So there is a big difference there.

 

Im not using your arguments at all. You had a doomsday whining meltdown last year. You focused on THIS season when I constantly have been saying not to because the rebuild is not complete yet.

 

Every thing in your posts continue to harp on this season. Frye was signed to a 4 year deal. Not essentially a 1 year deal with an option like Gordon's. That should tell you something right there, but I guess in your case it is easier to just want to be right so badly that you ignore the big picture.

[Franchero MVP 391]

Actually it's not true. Harris is not shooting 39% from 3. He is not a true PF and is not 7 feet tall. So there is a big difference there.

 

Exactly. Unless your expecting Harris to become Draymond Green, which he is nowhere close to, comparing Frye vs Harris makes no sense.

 

Anyone still hanging on to the Frye signing is just really trying to justify their hate for Henny. It does not have any cap implications moving forward. Yeah, he sucked this year, but it was a good thought at the time to bring in someone next to Vuc that could stretch the floor so that Payton Dipo and Gordon could develop their inside game this season.

 

And that job is done. Frye from here on out will be nothing but a big bodied bench player who can hit 3s.

 

We have plenty of other things to worry about this off season, and those are the things that will put Henny to the test.

[The Neighborhood Bully 266]

Anyone still hanging on to the Frye signing is just really trying to justify their hate for Henny. It does not have any cap implications moving forward.

 

With the Frye signing, we have between $9.8M and $24.4M in 2015 cap space, depending on what happens with cap holds/non-guaranteed contracts.

 

If we didn't sign Frye, we would have between $18M and $32.6M in 2015 cap space.

[Wilbur 48]

With the Frye signing, we have between $9.8M and $24.4M in 2015 cap space, depending on what happens with cap holds/non-guaranteed contracts.

 

If we didn't sign Frye, we would have between $18M and $32.6M in 2015 cap space.

 

What realistic free agent signing(s) would require us to have $32 million in cap room this year?

[Catman 380]

I already said Harris didn't shoot as well from 3, but I'm pretty sure literally every single coach would take the slightly lower 3pt percentage from Harris because the rest of his game is much better than anything Frye will bring. I don't care if Harris is a true PF or if he's shorter than Frye, playing him at the 4 vs playing Frye at the 4 will almost always yield better results and that's all that matters.

 

The meltdown was from your end champ, I simply stated my opinions and as usual if they go against yours you can't contain yourself. Hell, even recently you attempted to start an argument over my use of the word "okay" when describing Fournier's game. You live for arguing which is why every single time I've ever visited this forum you're arguing with someone.

 

Frye was signed to a four year deal because he probably wouldn't have come here if he wasn't offered that kind of deal. Rob obviously wanted him, and thought that he would bring much more than he did, so he threw a deal at him that Frye would be hesitant to turn down. Though you're back to contradicting arguments again, on one hand you point to the length of the deal as if to say it shows the quality of player Frye is, and on the other you've (more than once) attempted to downplay the negative impact he'll have on our team by pointing to his reduced cap percentage in future seasons.

 

Phasing Frye out as the season went along tells me the team knows they made a mistake. This isn't to say he can't offer SOMETHING in future seasons as a reserve playing limited minutes, but he's never going to live up to that contract when his one and only skill is always going to be overshadowed by his numerous weaknesses.

 

 

Eskobar, the irony that you say I "live for arguing" is amazing. Considering your very first post back here after your meltdown was to come at me, and every post since has been a direct rebuttal, I have to wonder if this is a classic case of Pot meeting Kettle.

 

My point with Fournier is that he is a far better shooter from 3 than Tobias, a guy you praised and then turned around and said Fournier was "okay". It made no sense. I would argue that Fournier is a better fit for this team.

 

Rob is not going to sign a guy for 4 years if he doesn't see a long term plan. He could have passed on the deal. For proof - Look at the other vet contracts inked this summer. The terms are all very short. Once again, the proof is right there. You complained and whined about Ben Gordon, but nobody seems to be whining about that anymore.

 

I am not trying to downplay anything. I am stating that it is a fact that an 8mm contract today is not going to equate to the same cap hit once the ceiling goes up. Just reality.

[Mauro Pedrosa 1,033]

Is it weird that KJ McDaniels is my #1 realistic free agent target?

 

In my mind there's 0% chance Kawhi and Draymond don't get matched and maybe it would take too much money to steal Danny Green from the Spurs (north of 12 million).

 

--

 

I think we need a 3 and D guy and some killer from 3 pt land. McDaniels could develop into the former and Hezonja could be the latter

 

I believe that Aaron Gordon has the tools to be the PF we need and I'd obviously count on some improvement from Vuc on defense.

 

I think we should re-sign Harris if he asks for 15 million or less. He could develop into an amazing SF or be more or less the same player he already is. If the latter happens, this rotation would still be awesome and very balanced

 

Payton / feisty backup PG

Oladipo / Fournier

Hezonja / McDaniels

Gordon / Harris

Vucevic / strong defensive C

 

I would only want Harris playing PF against backups

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

Is it weird that KJ McDaniels is my #1 realistic free agent target?

 

In my mind there's 0% chance Kawhi and Draymond don't get matched and maybe it would take too much money to steal Danny Green from the Spurs (north of 12 million).

 

--

 

I think we need a 3 and D guy and some killer from 3 pt land. McDaniels could develop into the former and Hezonja could be the latter

 

I believe that Aaron Gordon has the tools to be the PF we need and I'd obviously count on some improvement from Vuc on defense.

 

I think we should re-sign Harris if he asks for 15 million or less. He could develop into an amazing SF or be more or less the same player he already is. If the latter happens, this rotation would still be awesome and very balanced

 

Payton / feisty backup PG

Oladipo / Fournier

Hezonja / McDaniels

Gordon / Harris

Vucevic / strong defensive C

 

I would only want Harris playing PF against backups

 

I'll probably be back on the Hezonja train after his draft express video comes out next week. It's just hard to like him more than Winslow right now when there's like 3 of his games available to watch and his coach decided to bench him for a month.

[Mauro Pedrosa 1,033]

I'll probably be back on the Hezonja train after his draft express video comes out next week. It's just hard to like him more than Winslow right now when there's like 3 of his games available to watch and his coach decided to bench him for a month.

I like his combination of a state of the art shooting release and incredible dunking ability. His cockiness isn't too much of a concern to me. As long as he's not 2015 Rajon Rondo level crazy...

 

I've read many great things about Winslow but I just don't know if he's the right fit. If he starts with Payton, Oladipo and Aaron we will have a tough time scoring

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

I like his combination of a state of the art shooting release and incredible dunking ability. His cockiness isn't too much of a concern to me. As long as he's not 2015 Rajon Rondo level crazy...

 

I've read many great things about Winslow but I just don't know if he's the right fit. If he starts with Payton, Oladipo and Aaron we will have a tough time scoring

 

Right lol. His YouTube mixtape makes him look like a cross between Redick and Vince Carter. I just need to see him at his worst before I bump him.