2011 Playoffs

[Manu Ginobili 61]

Pippen said LeBron "might" be the best player ever, even better than MJ

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/chicago/nba/news/story?id=6599168

 

I think Jordan as a scorer cannot be argued. But LeBron´s defense and complete game is taking him to another level. While i think it´s improbable that he will be better than Jordan, given how clutch Michael was in the most important games, It can be a fair comparison if James follow this path of play, and his physical dominance, in 10 years.

 

Of the last 20 years, IMO he is already a top 4 talent, with Kobe, Shaq and Duncan being the others. But as a player, i like his game more than the other 3.

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

Pippen said LeBron "might" be the best player ever, even better than MJ

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/chicago/nba/news/story?id=6599168

 

I think Jordan as a scorer cannot be argued. But LeBron´s defense and complete game is taking him to another level. While i think it´s improbable that he will be better than Jordan, given how clutch Michael was in the most important games, It can be a fair comparison if James follow this path of play, and his physical dominance, in 10 years.

 

Of the last 20 years, IMO he is already a top 4 talent, with Kobe, Shaq and Duncan being the others. But as a player, i like his game more than the other 3.

 

Uhhhh. you are ridiculous. Lets just break this down.

 

Lebron's highest scoring average: 31.4ppg.

Jordan had 5 consecutive years above that average and 6 overall. His highest scoring year was 37.1ppg

 

But lebron is a great defender, right?

Lebron's highest steals per game season was 2.2 his highest blocks per game season was 1.1

Jordan had 8 seasons above 2.2 steals and 3 seasons above 1.1 blocks.

Jordan was the defensive player of the year in 87-88

Jordan was a 9 time all defensive first team player

 

Lebron doesn't have a complete game yet. In fact, that's his largest criticism. He has a pretty good midrange game and can get to the basket at will. He shoots terribly from 3. Jordan was never considered a great three point shooter for his career, but he had 4 good shooting seasons. Lebron has had 1 good three point shooting season. Lebron also doesn't shoot freethrows very well.

 

Lebron is a great player. But don't anoint him as the best ever when he needs to be playing at an extremely high level until he's in his mid-late 30's just to pass over Dr. J and the big O.

 

We shouldn't even be talking about this until 2019

[BMP 424]

Uhhhh. you are ridiculous. Lets just break this down.

 

Lebron's highest scoring average: 31.4ppg.

Jordan had 5 consecutive years above that average and 6 overall. His highest scoring year was 37.1ppg

 

But lebron is a great defender, right?

Lebron's highest steals per game season was 2.2 his highest blocks per game season was 1.1

Jordan had 8 seasons above 2.2 steals and 3 seasons above 1.1 blocks.

Jordan was the defensive player of the year in 87-88

Jordan was a 9 time all defensive first team player

 

Lebron doesn't have a complete game yet. In fact, that's his largest criticism. He has a pretty good midrange game and can get to the basket at will. He shoots terribly from 3. Jordan was never considered a great three point shooter for his career, but he had 4 good shooting seasons. Lebron has had 1 good three point shooting season. Lebron also doesn't shoot freethrows very well.

 

Lebron is a great player. But don't anoint him as the best ever when he needs to be playing at an extremely high level until he's in his mid-late 30's just to pass over Dr. J and the big O.

 

We shouldn't even be talking about this until 2019

 

 

I also think they would only be able to compared in regards to dominance in the era. Skillwise, LeBron is far away from Jordan

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

Pippen said LeBron "might" be the best player ever, even better than MJ

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/chicago/nba/news/story?id=6599168

 

I think Jordan as a scorer cannot be argued. But LeBron´s defense and complete game is taking him to another level. While i think it´s improbable that he will be better than Jordan, given how clutch Michael was in the most important games, It can be a fair comparison if James follow this path of play, and his physical dominance, in 10 years.

 

Of the last 20 years, IMO he is already a top 4 talent, with Kobe, Shaq and Duncan being the others. But as a player, i like his game more than the other 3.

 

Of the last 20 years i have

 

Jordan, Hakeem, Karl Malone, David Robinson, Charles Barkley, Kobe, Shaq, Duncan, Kevin Garnett, all above lebron. I could see how people could justify Iverson or Dirk Nowitzki too. Lebron gets hype because of what his career COULD be. Not what it's been.

 

I bet you were born in the 90's

[Manu Ginobili 61]

Of the last 20 years i have

 

Jordan, Hakeem, Karl Malone, David Robinson, Charles Barkley, Kobe, Shaq, Duncan, Kevin Garnett, all above lebron. I could see how people could justify Iverson or Dirk Nowitzki too. Lebron gets hype because of what his career COULD be. Not what it's been.

 

I bet you were born in the 90's

 

I was born in early 80´s.

 

Garnett, Iverson, Nowitzki, are nowhere above LeBron. They are well bellow him. Its actually ridiculous to compare Garnett´s level with James, i can´t believe you brought him up.

 

All you gave me to justify your opinion were pure stats. Did you take into account that Jordan never played alone in a team with nobodies like LeBron?.

 

Now James is probably gonna win the title, and the merit is not the same, because he´s as well surrounded as any star could be. EVER. His legacy will be tarnished by the fact he gave up on trying to win a title by himself, and had to get (not 1) but TWO all-stars in order to do it.

 

But James was a freakin beast well before, in Cleveland. I mean, the guy DOES have a complete game. How can you say he does not? It´s absurd that you point out his 3pt shooting ability. As if all SF´s were great outside shooters. As if he had not hit clutch threes in the past (i remember the one that hurt the most, G2 against us. But G5 in Chicago was a good reminder). He scores at will, and he does not do it only with his enormous physical power, he does it from mid-range too. He is a good FT shooter. Impact defender. Gets in transition like no other. Can take over a game, even though having played all 48 mins of it. Blocks shots. Rebounds. Steals (Rose suffered all 3 of them).

 

If you want to argue about the level of a certain player, please do not bring up stats all the time. We are talking about a guy averaging 28/7/7 for his career, shooting 48% from the field. Those are pretty impressive. But numbers do not tell the whole story. Apparently for you they do.

 

Jordan is the best ever. It is doubtful that he will be de-throned. But James has the best shot. And not for the number of rings (he will win a couple at least, for sure). But for his complete dominance of a 10 men game, in all its phacets.

 

Now, excuse me, i am gonna puke. I have been defending LeBron for the last 5 minutes.

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

I was born in early 80´s.

 

Garnett, Iverson, Nowitzki, are nowhere above LeBron. They are well bellow him. Its actually ridiculous to compare Garnett´s level with James, i can´t believe you brought him up.

 

All you gave me to justify your opinion were pure stats. Did you take into account that Jordan never played alone in a team with nobodies like LeBron?.

 

Now James is probably gonna win the title, and the merit is not the same, because he´s as well surrounded as any star could be. EVER. His legacy will be tarnished by the fact he gave up on trying to win a title by himself, and had to get (not 1) but TWO all-stars in order to do it.

 

But James was a freakin beast well before, in Cleveland. I mean, the guy DOES have a complete game. How can you say he does not? It´s absurd that you point out his 3pt shooting ability. As if all SF´s were great outside shooters. As if he had not hit clutch threes in the past (i remember the one that hurt the most, G2 against us. But G5 in Chicago was a good reminder). He scores at will, and he does not do it only with his enormous physical power, he does it from mid-range too. He is a good FT shooter. Impact defender. Gets in transition like no other. Can take over a game, even though having played all 48 mins of it. Blocks shots. Rebounds. Steals (Rose suffered all 3 of them).

 

If you want to argue about the level of a certain player, please do not bring up stats all the time. We are talking about a guy averaging 28/7/7 for his career, shooting 48% from the field. Those are pretty impressive. But numbers do not tell the whole story. Apparently for you they do.

 

Jordan is the best ever. It is doubtful that he will be de-throned. But James has the best shot. And not for the number of rings (he will win a couple at least, for sure). But for his complete dominance of a 10 men game, in all its phacets.

 

Now, excuse me, i am gonna puke. I have been defending LeBron for the last 5 minutes.

 

Jordan played with nobodies from 1984-1988.

 

Probably's dont count. If probablys count then Jordan probably could have added another 6500 points onto his career if he didn't get injured in his second year and didn't play baseball. That would have given him enough points to pass Kareem for most points in a career.

 

You say he's impressive so he must be the best ever. But Dr J, Kobe, Oscar Robertson, Dominique Wilkens, George Gervin, Alex English, Larry Bird, Magic Johnson, etc were all pretty dominant too.

[BMP 424]

lol, how is it ridiculous to compare KG? KG's one of the greatest PFs in the history of the league. The guy did what LeBron did with Minnesota but for more years, and while his ring did come with other HOFs, it's nothing like LeBron's, because those guys were well past their primes and none of them were top 3 players.

 

 

 

And yes, Dirk is definitely above LeBron. Hell, LeBron has yet to surpass TMac's and Wincent's career numbers, and in the end, that's what matters. You don't judge how great a player is going to be by what he MAY do. . . for all we know he could get his kneecap shot up and never play again.

 

 

 

 

And LeBron does not have a complete game. He's decent from midrange, but not very good in the post (unless he has a 6'4 guy guarding him), also not a good 3pt shooter. He's a good jump shooter overall because of how much of it isn't assisted, but to be good when compared to the all-time greats isn't enough. I'd especially like to see how well his game will translate once the athleticism isn't there anymore.

 

 

 

The guy is definitely the best player in the league and all, but stop acting like he's going to continue to do this for much longer. He'll start declining in 2-3 years. He may only be 26 (or 27?) but he has already played the amount of minutes guys in the 30s have played (has played more than O'Neal, Parker), and is a season's worth away from guys like Camby, Rip, Baron Davis, Peja,

 

 

 

 

The way you described LeBron is how you describe nearly every single top 20 player in the history of the game. . .

[ML6 520]

Pippen said LeBron "might" be the best player ever, even better than MJ

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/chicago/nba/news/story?id=6599168

 

I think Jordan as a scorer cannot be argued. But LeBron´s defense and complete game is taking him to another level.

 

I don't know if you meant this to sounds as ridiculous as it does or if you just worded it poorly, but your statement implies that Jordan lacked defense or a complete game. Pippen said something to the same extent, making it sound as if LeBron's defense is what could vault him into Jordan's realm. H4TW mentioned it but it needs to be reiterated: Michael Jordan is one of the greatest defenders of all time. If there is any reasonable argument as to why LBJ "might" be better than Jordan (which at this point there isn't), it CERTAINLY isn't defense.

 

I don't mean to sound dismissive, but at this point in time it's truly a ridiculous argument. It might be even crazier than Bucher continuing to say that Rose is better than LeBron and that the ECF only solidified that belief. Could LBJ be better than MJ when all is said and done? Sure, it's a possibility. But why talk about it now when there is 0 evidence?

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

I don't know if you meant this to sounds as ridiculous as it does or if you just worded it poorly, but your statement implies that Jordan lacked defense or a complete game. Pippen said something to the same extent, making it sound as if LeBron's defense is what could vault him into Jordan's realm. H4TW mentioned it but it needs to be reiterated: Michael Jordan is one of the greatest defenders of all time. If there is any reasonable argument as to why LBJ "might" be better than Jordan (which at this point there isn't), it CERTAINLY isn't defense.

 

I don't mean to sound dismissive, but at this point in time it's truly a ridiculous argument. It might be even crazier than Bucher continuing to say that Rose is better than LeBron and that the ECF only solidified that belief. Could LBJ be better than MJ when all is said and done? Sure, it's a possibility. But why talk about it now when there is 0 evidence?

 

Right. People don't really understand the historical significance of Jordan.

[VCplusD12 91]

1- Vince Carter

2- Michael Jordan

3- LeBron James

 

You're blind if you don't see this

[NameLess Scrub 6]

One of you might find it useful to start a new thread in the Off-Topic forum. This seems like a productive conversation, but not one that should be happening here.

 

There were like 4 of us.. 2 at the end... well anyway...

 

 

About Lebron, I can only hope the guy keeps on losing so when he finally wins a title he hopefully has learned something different from being full of himself.

 

Go Jordan!

 

Go Dirk, save us!!!

[Trey Time 186]

1- Vince Carter

2- Michael Jordan

3- LeBron James

 

You're blind if you don't see this

 

:shard: