2017 Official Offseason Thread

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

Our options are to extend him this year at less than what he will get if we wait until free agency or wait until free agency and sign him for big for the sake of seeing if he improves at a large enough level or offer him an fournier extention that he will turn down because he knows where the market is.

 

What do you propose we do?

 

and that's the rub.

 

I'd rather pay Gordon 5/25 because every dollar we give him is a dollar we don't have to offer another player for the length of his deal. but he'll bet on himself if we offer him a Fournier deal.

 

if he doesn't get better he's worth Fournier. if he gets significantly better he'll be worth the max. that's why I threw out a flat 23/year deal. big enough that he'll definitely consider taking it vs just waiting until free agency. because all options considered, paying a guy 23 a year when he's worth 17 a year isn't that bad and the savings of 23, 23, 23, 23, 23 vs 26.3, 27.6, 28.9, 30.4 or worse 26.3, 28.4, 30.6, 33.1, 35.7 is huge.

 

but we'll see what Wiggins and Jokic get first. if they take less Gordon's market drops.

[HeHateMe 697]

Doesn't negate his point

 

Nor mine.

[HeHateMe 697]

and that's the rub.

 

I'd rather pay Gordon 5/25 because every dollar we give him is a dollar we don't have to offer another player for the length of his deal. but he'll bet on himself if we offer him a Fournier deal.

 

if he doesn't get better he's worth Fournier. if he gets significantly better he'll be worth the max. that's why I threw out a flat 23/year deal. big enough that he'll definitely consider taking it vs just waiting until free agency. because all options considered, paying a guy 23 a year when he's worth 17 a year isn't that bad and the savings of 23, 23, 23, 23, 23 vs 26.3, 27.6, 28.9, 30.4 or worse 26.3, 28.4, 30.6, 33.1, 35.7 is huge.

 

but we'll see what Wiggins and Jokic get first. if they take less Gordon's market drops.

 

Yea I'm not even a big AG guy but I'd rather get it done sooner so it doesn't wrap up more money later.

[Soul Bro 1,419]

and that's the rub.

 

I'd rather pay Gordon 5/25 because every dollar we give him is a dollar we don't have to offer another player for the length of his deal. but he'll bet on himself if we offer him a Fournier deal.

 

if he doesn't get better he's worth Fournier. if he gets significantly better he'll be worth the max. that's why I threw out a flat 23/year deal. big enough that he'll definitely consider taking it vs just waiting until free agency. because all options considered, paying a guy 23 a year when he's worth 17 a year isn't that bad and the savings of 23, 23, 23, 23, 23 vs 26.3, 27.6, 28.9, 30.4 or worse 26.3, 28.4, 30.6, 33.1, 35.7 is huge.

 

but we'll see what Wiggins and Jokic get first. if they take less Gordon's market drops.

Outside of that site you shared, I just don't see how we could justify paying AG 25 million a year. He's not in the same category of Wiggins or Jokic, and I don't even think the league values him at Dipo's price tag right now. To me, given what we've seen and how raw he still is, I think Dipo's deal is his ceiling at the moment. AG has yet to prove he's more than a high energy and good defensive forward, which means he'd be a 3rd or 4th guy on a contender.

[Soul Bro 1,419]

It's troubling that we still don't know what we have in EP and AG.

[HeHateMe 697]

Outside of that site you shared, I just don't see how we could justify paying AG 25 million a year. He's not in the same category of Wiggins or Jokic, and I don't even think the league values him at Dipo's price tag right now. To me, given what we've seen and how raw he still is, I think Dipo's deal is his ceiling at the moment. AG has yet to prove he's more than a high energy and good defensive forward, which means he'd be a 3rd or 4th guy on a contender.

 

I hope you are right because I feel the same. I still think he projects as nothing more then an above average role player if that. Possibly an elite defender but he's gonna struggle against true 4's that are just bigger than him.

[HeHateMe 697]

It's troubling that we still don't know what we have in EP and AG.

 

I think we know what we have In Payton more so then AG.

 

I wish rookie deals were longer so for guys like AG that come in when they really should stay in college we'd have more time to make a decision.

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

the really interesting one is payton.

 

 

I don't even know what to do with him other than wait and see.

 

He was statistically our best player post all star. But someone pointed out to me yesterday that these numbers might be skewed by only playing 6 minutes total with augustin post all star.

 

so was Payton our best player post all star? this definitely could still be the case.

 

or maybe it was Fournier or vucevic or Gordon but their overall numbers dipped by playing with augustin.

[Odin 137]

and that's the rub.

 

I'd rather pay Gordon 5/25 because every dollar we give him is a dollar we don't have to offer another player for the length of his deal. but he'll bet on himself if we offer him a Fournier deal.

 

if he doesn't get better he's worth Fournier. if he gets significantly better he'll be worth the max. that's why I threw out a flat 23/year deal. big enough that he'll definitely consider taking it vs just waiting until free agency. because all options considered, paying a guy 23 a year when he's worth 17 a year isn't that bad and the savings of 23, 23, 23, 23, 23 vs 26.3, 27.6, 28.9, 30.4 or worse 26.3, 28.4, 30.6, 33.1, 35.7 is huge.

 

but we'll see what Wiggins and Jokic get first. if they take less Gordon's market drops.

 

I think we should look at him as a percentage of the cap. What percentage of the cap is he worth? 15%? 20%? 25%

 

Rudy Gay, who seems to be one of his closer comps, basically ended up being valued at 26.7% of the cap after his rookie contract- but that seems very high. If we could get him at around 20% of the cap, if not lower, that might be a decent deal for us.

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

I think we should look at him as a percentage of the cap. What percentage of the cap is he worth? 15%? 20%? 25%

 

Rudy Gay, who seems to be one of his closer comps, basically ended up being valued at 26.7% of the cap after his rookie contract- but that seems very high. If we could get him at around 20% of the cap, if not lower, that might be a decent deal for us.

 

well the most he could possibly get unless he decides to become a first team all nba player or mvp next year is 25% of the cap but the yearly 8% raises might bring him above that.

[HeHateMe 697]

well the most he could possibly get unless he decides to become a first team all nba player or mvp next year is 25% of the cap but the yearly 8% raises might bring him above that.

 

I'd love it if Payton became the clear best player on the team next year.

 

I'm not holding my breath but I actually have a small hope he continues his post all star play.

 

What if he improves a bunch and AG doesn't? We haven't discussed that unlikely scenario.

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

I'd love it if Payton became the clear best player on the team next year.

 

I'm not holding my breath but I actually have a small hope he continues his post all star play.

 

What if he improves a bunch and AG doesn't? We haven't discussed that unlikely scenario.

 

So for this exercise lets use Gordon's 15/16 post all star numbers because his SF numbers really killed his rebounding last year and I don't think 16 and 6 as "not improving". So that's 12 ppg 7 rpg 48/29/65 shooting at 22 years old.

 

James Johnson got 4/60 and he's almost 31

Ibaka got 3/65 and slowly declining.

 

harkless got 4/40 after averaging 6.4 and 3.6 for one year with Portland

Barnes got 5/94 after averaging 11.7 and 4.9

 

so more than james Johnson, less than barnes? that's a big gap.