Odin 137 Report post Posted November 4, 2016 Hezonja currently has a PER of 1.1. I know, small sample size, but even so, that is pretty sad. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
magicblue 315 Report post Posted November 4, 2016 see that's the thing. You look back and think "how many meaningful nba games did hezonja have last year? 2? 3?" In reality it was closer to 20. It's just been 3 in the last 7 months. Yeah, I definitely don't recall 20. Might depend on how we're defining "meaningful". Regardless, there has been little improvement, if any, from last year...at least to this point anyways. I mean I would love a guarantee that he turns into Korver, yet many believe his ceiling is higher. I'm just not sure what that opinion is based on considering what we've seen so far. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ibn Battuta 127 Report post Posted November 4, 2016 Vogel limiting Hezonja FIVE games into the season says it all IMO If Rob traded Harkless when he wasn't good here I have to think he'll also trade Hezonja. You can't wait two or three seasons from now for him to start getting it. As a fan I see all these other rookies and younger players "getting it" from day one and then question why Hezonja doesn't. I remember in the 2nd quarter. Hezonja guarding Casspi and Lawson sets him a screen. All Hezonja has to do is hedge correctly and instead Casspi comes back and turns the corner for the easy layup. Like how you can make that big of a mental mistake, against flippin OMRI CASSPI. He looks and walks like a rookie out there. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Odin 137 Report post Posted November 4, 2016 Vogel limiting Hezonja FIVE games into the season says it all IMO If Rob traded Harkless when he wasn't good here I have to think he'll also trade Hezonja. You can't wait two or three seasons from now for him to start getting it. As a fan I see all these other rookies and younger players "getting it" from day one and then question why Hezonja doesn't. I get what you are saying, but hopefully Hennigan is not making decisions as a fan. Also, being patient can have its benefits: See JJ Reddick, and there are plenty of other high picks that are struggling. Honestly, it doesn't hurt us much to wait. While he has been pretty bad these 5 games, he has not been a major reason for any of the losses. All that said, I will not be surprised if we look at moving on from Hezonja sooner rather than later if something doesn't change within the next few months. But I don't think he has a heck of a lot of trade value at the moment either. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fultz4thewin 2,464 Report post Posted November 4, 2016 Yeah, I definitely don't recall 20. Might depend on how we're defining "meaningful". Regardless, there has been little improvement, if any, from last year...at least to this point anyways. I mean I would love a guarantee that he turns into Korver, yet many believe his ceiling is higher. I'm just not sure what that opinion is based on considering what we've seen so far. So the easy to remember ones are Washington Milwaukee Chicago Milwaukee again Then there's Philly Okc Boston Knicks Atlanta And another group of games that I'll examine for validity. Like do we want to include the hornets game where he went in down 21 but was part of a group that lead a comeback? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fultz4thewin 2,464 Report post Posted November 4, 2016 Vogel limiting Hezonja FIVE games into the season says it all IMO If Rob traded Harkless when he wasn't good here I have to think he'll also trade Hezonja. You can't wait two or three seasons from now for him to start getting it. As a fan I see all these other rookies and younger players "getting it" from day one and then question why Hezonja doesn't. I remember in the 2nd quarter. Hezonja guarding Casspi and Lawson sets him a screen. All Hezonja has to do is hedge correctly and instead Casspi comes back and turns the corner for the easy layup. Like how you can make that big of a mental mistake, against flippin OMRI CASSPI. He looks and walks like a rookie out there. Rob traded harkless right before year 4. You absolutely can wait 2 seasons to see if he'll get it. That's the benefit of rookie contracts. We can start having this conversation in January 2018. Right now it's premature Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ibn Battuta 127 Report post Posted November 4, 2016 I get what you are saying, but hopefully Hennigan is not making decisions as a fan. Also, being patient can have its benefits: See JJ Reddick, and there are plenty of other high picks that are struggling. Honestly, it doesn't hurt us much to wait. While he has been pretty bad these 5 games, he has not been a major reason for any of the losses. All that said, I will not be surprised if we look at moving on from Hezonja sooner rather than later if something doesn't change within the next few months. But I don't think he has a heck of a lot of trade value at the moment either. I'm so tired of the JJ comparison. He shot better than Hezonja! Almost 39% from outside his rookie and sophomore seasons. There is literally nothing you can point to for Hezonja. Shooting 35% from 3 is just OK. I guess we like being OK... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ibn Battuta 127 Report post Posted November 4, 2016 Rob traded harkless right before year 4. You absolutely can wait 2 seasons to see if he'll get it. That's the benefit of rookie contracts. We can start having this conversation in January 2018. Right now it's premature In economics this is a sunk cost. If you trust the coaches and scouts and trainers who work with him on a day to day basis and he is losing minutes to CJ Watson, then cut your losses short! If by the AS break he's still playing like this then...ughhh don't even wanna think about it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Janders 102 Report post Posted November 4, 2016 In economics this is a sunk cost. If you trust the coaches and scouts and trainers who work with him on a day to day basis and he is losing minutes to CJ Watson, then cut your losses short! If by the AS break he's still playing like this then...ughhh don't even wanna think about it. Mario has been godawful so far this season but I don't see how you can call a guy 5 games into the 2nd year of a rookie contract a sunk cost Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fultz4thewin 2,464 Report post Posted November 4, 2016 In economics this is a sunk cost. If you trust the coaches and scouts and trainers who work with him on a day to day basis and he is losing minutes to CJ Watson, then cut your losses short! If by the AS break he's still playing like this then...ughhh don't even wanna think about it. He's not losing minutes to Watson. Wilcox is losing minutes to Watson. He doesn't apply to the sunk costs fallacy yet because we haven't yet gotten to a point where we can determine his value and the bygones principle would say the current cost of keeping him on the roster (i.e. contract and whatever the value of the 9th spot in a rotation is) doesn't outweigh the benefits (odds of development are still pretty high at this point in time) therefore it doesn't make sense yet to cash out. Especially when his value is going to stay the same over the next year Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ibn Battuta 127 Report post Posted November 4, 2016 He's not losing minutes to Watson. Wilcox is losing minutes to Watson. He doesn't apply to the sunk costs fallacy yet because we haven't yet gotten to a point where we can determine his value and the bygones principle would say the current cost of keeping him on the roster (i.e. contract and whatever the value of the 9th spot in a rotation is) doesn't outweigh the benefits (odds of development are still pretty high at this point in time) therefore it doesn't make sense yet to cash out. Especially when his value is going to stay the same over the next year You make some good points but, if we're trying to make the playoffs this season then I'm just not seeing how planting Hezonja on the bench is good for him or the team. I'm not saying move him after 5 games but if by the break he hasn't shown improvement and we're in the thick of it, then consider some other team to deal with it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fultz4thewin 2,464 Report post Posted November 4, 2016 You make some good points but, if we're trying to make the playoffs this season then I'm just not seeing how planting Hezonja on the bench is good for him or the team. I'm not saying move him after 5 games but if by the break he hasn't shown improvement and we're in the thick of it, then consider some other team to deal with it. I think if there's a reasonable trade near the deadline and he hasn't improved then sure, we can trade him. I think the "cut bait" point is somewhere in the Feb 2018 ballpark. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
