The Official 2015-2016 Regular Season Thread

[Magicman28 295]

I've questioned Payton a lot but I also don't see the point in labeling who he's going to be yet. Still too early.

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

I've questioned Payton a lot but I also don't see the point in labeling who he's going to be yet. Still too early.

 

sure. but we can figure out the upper/lower limits

[Magicman28 295]

sure. but we can figure out the upper/lower limits

 

 

Speculate is a better word.

 

I just don't like the options being discussed as possible improvements.

 

I rather give EP a couple more years.

[Mauro Pedrosa 1,032]

We get basically no offense from our PG and basically no defense from our C.

 

I think it should be the other way around, if we can't get a two-way player for those positions

[The Neighborhood Bully 266]

We get basically no offense from our PG and basically no defense from our C.

 

I think it should be the other way around, if we can't get a two-way player for those positions

If you take a closer look, you'll see we're not getting much defense from our PG either. Payton's 107 defensive rating this year is worse than Isiah Thomas' 106.

[Franchero MVP 391]

I don't get why we should get Whiteside. I understand he can block, but does he really improve Miami's defense that much? I remember reading the article that said their defense was better when he was on the bench.

[Murphy13 185]

Well, point guard is our second weakest position, so that riddle solves itself. Derozen is one of the better scorers in the league and he's not even reached him prime (just 26). Not sure what more there is to say. Sure I'd rather Durant but I'm being somewhat realistic. I'm also on board with Whiteside.

 

The guard position is our greatest depth on the team; I would place PF as our weakest position, with frontcourt defense/center being second weakest. YOu could conceivably combine those two into one weakness, but I think we need two frontcourt players before we even think about adding another PG.

[magicblue 315]

no, its really not.

 

Payton will never be a top tier point guard. we discussed this when he was drafted. we discussed this during his rookie year. we discussed this now.

 

This isn't a debate. it's fact. He always had a mike conley-ish ceiling which is really good but not elite. It's not an insult. it doesn't really effect whether we keep him or not. it just is.

 

Oh okay, end of discussion I suppose.

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

I don't get why we should get Whiteside. I understand he can block, but does he really improve Miami's defense that much? I remember reading the article that said their defense was better when he was on the bench.

 

 

here's where stats get weird.

 

So NBA.com has Whiteside's on court defensive rating as 101 and his off court defensive rating as 99.3. We don't really know the cause of this because it's similar with Wade and Deng. It might be like this because Justice Winslow is shutting down backups.

 

For comparison, Vucevic on/off defensive rating is 105/100

 

 

Now basketball reference calculates Whiteside's defensive rating as 93, the best in the league, and his DBPM as 4.2 which is third in the league. I don't know what causes the discrepancy between the two sites.

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

Oh okay, end of discussion I suppose.

 

 

not trying to be a dick about it. Just when you look at payton has there been anything that stands out to say "man, this guy is going to be the best point guard in the league".

 

Its the opposite with Gordon. We could check off boxes

 

elite athleticism

elite size

elite defense

 

oh ok he can dribble

 

oh ok he can shoot threes

 

oh ok he can take guys off the dribble.

 

if you do the math you can see a path to becoming an elite player. You don't have that with Payton. That's why he went 11th.

[Mauro Pedrosa 1,032]

If you take a closer look, you'll see we're not getting much defense from our PG either. Payton's 107 defensive rating this year is worse than Isiah Thomas' 106.

Right, I just didn't want to be too harsh.

 

I think he'll be a solid backup, but I think you're screwed if he's your starting PG

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

last 8 games:

 

Hezonja offensive rating 105, defensive rating 96.3. When he's on the bench the magic are at 106.7/111.8

 

Gordon offensive rating 107.9, Defensive rating 101.6. On the bench- 103/112

 

Oladipo offensive rating 108.8, Defensive rating 102. On the bench- 98/117

 

 

bench players are killing the defense. specifically ilyasova and Watson at shooting guard. Jennings and smith have been bad.

 

starting lineup with Hezonja has been killing it. Lineups with two point guards (Watson/payton, Jennings/payton, Watson/Jennings) have been the point of our destruction.