Nash May Become Available

[Ibn Battuta 127]

Because the role of a point guard on the Magic(or any other team), like every other position(on any team), is to maximize the production of your best, most consistent player, and to build off that while minimizing the limitations of your team. We have shooters because that's what maximizes Dwight's talents. Yes, we COULD completely revamp our offensive system to maximize Steve Nash, but doing so would be about the stupidest goddamn thing we could do, even after making the already absurd decision to swap Jameer and Nash.

 

But kudos on missing the larger point of my post entirely, which was that the numbers a player puts up can't be separated from the system they play in. Nash would be GROSSLY less effective playing here, in a system built around someone else, than in a system built around him.

 

Or to put it another way: we could revamp our offensive specifically so that Jameer would put up better numbers, maybe even so he'd put up better numbers than Steve Nash(at least in terms of assists).

 

It would, however, be completely idiotic and detrimental to the team to do so.

 

I have no idea what you are talking about. What makes you think Steve Nash would completely change the team? If the offense revolves around Dwight you like you say it does, then why would Nash change that? If anything it makes it deadlier because of Nash's exceptional ability to draw defenses and deliver the ball with deadly precision. Idk i'm doing a lot of accounting homework so I could be off, but I do not understand what you are saying. We wouldn't bring Nash to make himself look better or bigger numbers: he's already doing that by himself with a gutted PHX team. He would come here and make EVERYONE around him that much better. At any rate I will take Ken Berger's word over yours.

 

All I know is that Nash, a 2-time MVP and future HOFer, a great skill set, could solve a lot of the passing issues we seem to be having. If Nash can do what he did for Amar'e to Dwight, then wow what an upgrade and completely worth it.

[Ibn Battuta 127]

And looking at their numbers so far this season on a per minute basis, he's only barely been better than Jameer on offense, if at all, and Jameer is clearly a better defensive player.

 

are you making this comment out of pure ignorance? Or did you just forget that Nash's partner in crime Amar'e isn't there anymore, and he has a gutted team that will (barely) fight for a playoff spot?

[Bauncey Chillups 288]

And looking at their numbers so far this season on a per minute basis, he's only barely been better than Jameer on offense, if at all, and Jameer is clearly a better defensive player.

 

Brandon Bass is a 16/10/2 guy according to his per36s' as well.

[ML6 520]

Adding either Nash or Wall to the Orlando Magic as currently constructed would do absolutely nothing to better our chances of winning a title. Talent doesn't just add up. You can't take player X from team Y and expect them to do the exact same things with team Z, since it is a completely different system built upon completely different schemes.

 

But I guess if we want to sacrifice the next 3 seasons developing Wall at the expense of Dwight or waste the talents of both Nash and Dwight at the same time, then so be it. I'll still watch.

[BMP 424]

But the thing is, I can understand Nash, but Wall????? Because he had a triple double??? And don't tell me it's because of potential because you don't trade your second best player for "potential" (as a win now team).

 

 

7 or so games into the season and Wall of the sudden is the clear better player than Jameer? Not only that, but his game is nearly the exact OPPOSITE of this team needs and he would make us worse by a very large amount.

[Secretly Space Jesus 670]

Brandon Bass is a 16/10/2 guy according to his per36s' as well.

 

Yep. He's played well on offense so far, and he's rebounding better than he ever has previously. Lets hope it continues.

 

He has still yet to defend a pick and roll correctly ever(he shows WAY too hard) and he's still something of a ball stopper on offense, but those are minor complaints.

 

I'm also not sure what this has to do with anything. Particularly since I wasn't comparing a role playing back up to a full time starter. I was comparing two starters, one of whom plays 5.5mpg more than the other.

 

If you like I can adjust for pace too.

[Secretly Space Jesus 670]

are you making this comment out of pure ignorance? Or did you just forget that Nash's partner in crime Amar'e isn't there anymore, and he has a gutted team that will (barely) fight for a playoff spot?

 

No, I remember all that. I'm not sure how or why it's relevant, since the goal would be to win not demonstrate that Nash is better than his current stats indicate he is in Phoenix.

 

As for your other post:

 

And I've yet to hear an explanation as to how Nash makes us better in the half-court offense(I won't even ask about defense) to justify trading for him over Jameer.

 

We could, of course, go to an uptempo offense, but that would be, you know, adjusting our offense to better fit Nash, which was the whole point. Gentry tried to make Nash play in a half-court offense 2 years ago, and his numbers dropped dramatically. And that was two years ago, before he started to (slightly) decline.

 

I have all the respect for Nash in the world, and the fact that he's holding onto his prime like Stockton did is a testament to his conditioning, but a) he's clearly not as good as he was even 3 years ago, let alone when he got that MVP he deserved 5 years ago, and maintaining a belief that any player can maintain peak performance when they turn 37 this season is naive at best.

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

No, I remember all that. I'm not sure how or why it's relevant, since the goal would be to win not demonstrate that Nash is better than his current stats indicate he is in Phoenix.

 

As for your other post:

 

And I've yet to hear an explanation as to how Nash makes us better in the half-court offense(I won't even ask about defense) to justify trading for him over Jameer.

 

We could, of course, go to an uptempo offense, but that would be, you know, adjusting our offense to better fit Nash, which was the whole point. Gentry tried to make Nash play in a half-court offense 2 years ago, and his numbers dropped dramatically. And that was two years ago, before he started to (slightly) decline.

 

I have all the respect for Nash in the world, and the fact that he's holding onto his prime like Stockton did is a testament to his conditioning, but a) he's clearly not as good as he was even 3 years ago, let alone when he got that MVP he deserved 5 years ago, and maintaining a belief that any player can maintain peak performance when they turn 37 this season is naive at best.

 

i just want Nash due to the 48%-44%-89%. His declining numbers are better than Jameer's best. His assist numbers would go down significantly due to the swing the ball around the perimeter type of offense we use, but a Nash-Dwight pick and roll would be deadly.

 

It'd be dumb to break the bank to get him here, but if they pull a "Lets give Nash to a contender because he's been so loyal to us" type of deal I wouldn't be opposed to dealing nelson and some of our depth over to phoenix.

[Ibn Battuta 127]

No, I remember all that. I'm not sure how or why it's relevant, since the goal would be to win not demonstrate that Nash is better than his current stats indicate he is in Phoenix.

 

As for your other post:

 

And I've yet to hear an explanation as to how Nash makes us better in the half-court offense(I won't even ask about defense) to justify trading for him over Jameer.

 

We could, of course, go to an uptempo offense, but that would be, you know, adjusting our offense to better fit Nash, which was the whole point. Gentry tried to make Nash play in a half-court offense 2 years ago, and his numbers dropped dramatically. And that was two years ago, before he started to (slightly) decline.

 

I have all the respect for Nash in the world, and the fact that he's holding onto his prime like Stockton did is a testament to his conditioning, but a) he's clearly not as good as he was even 3 years ago, let alone when he got that MVP he deserved 5 years ago, and maintaining a belief that any player can maintain peak performance when they turn 37 this season is naive at best.

 

Let's agree to disagree for now. There's really no point 7 games into the season; it's way too early to tell anything. But I will say this: we've played 3 contending teams so far and we are 1-2. One common theme in both losses (even the win) is our inability to make passes. Stan has said this multiple times as well: we just don't pass very well when the going gets tough. And of course this reflects on the PG because he has the rock in his hand and setting up the plays and directing traffic. He is the commander, the floor general. Jameer is awesome when he is keeping defenses honest with his hot shooting and quickness to the rim. When I think of Jameer ballin' out of control, it's not him getting Lewis or Vince involved and creating plays for everyone. It's him going 8/12 and 3/5 from 3, with highlight reels to dwight when he beats his man with that quickness. And yes he does kick it out, but it's a difficult pass and sometimes he can't deliver it perfectly. I feel this is one part of what happened last ECF: Jameer averaged 4 t/o leading to a 1:1 ratio.

 

We have a lot, A LOT, of talent on the team. Too much if you ask me. I just hope that all the talent can come together sooner rather than later. That's why Nash makes a lot of sense to me, because he has that ability to just make everyone around him better and make plays out of nothing. But yea, i'm gonna be patient and hope for the best; hopefully by the AS break we won't even be having this conversation.

 

and c'mon man, it was just last season Nash took the team to WCF. And the Suns didn't have a paint presence b/c Lopez was out. Nash would be protected here defensively.

[Secretly Space Jesus 670]

There's really no point 7 games into the season;

 

And then 2 sentences later:

 

But I will say this: we've played 3 contending teams so far and we are 1-2.

[Ibn Battuta 127]

And then 2 sentences later:

 

our ball movement issues are real. get over it.

[BMP 424]

Ball movement issues? I love how we got from one of the better teams at moving the ball to one of the worst after a Stan quote. If anything, the one thing this team truly lacks is CONSISTENT play-making from the wing, THAT is certainly an issue, but ball movement?

 

 

Also, I fail to see where ball movement/passing lacked in that Utah game. I feel like sometimes people just look at the result, completely ignore what happened in the actual game, and then just spin their "excuse wheel" to make something up. This time, passing (on a 23 assist game) was an issue in this loss (never mind the 21 turnovers and 56% shooting from the FT line).