Seems like Mcgrady and Mike Miller want back in Orlando. Hmmmm

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

What this argument basically boils down to is one side that overrates mike miller while simultaneously underrating Pietrus and his contributions to this team and Defense as a whole.

 

The other side overrates Pietrus' offensive ability.

 

Then there's the rational people.

[PNuT1423 0]

quote:

Originally posted by ThisIsTheYear:

There's an inordinate amount of baseless comments in this thread. Pietrus never has, nor will he ever be, the offensive player Mike Miller was/is. Discounting one season, his final season with the Magic where he was forced upon becoming our 2nd scoring option, Mike has never shot below 43%. Pietrus, by contrast, has only shot above this clip three times in seven seasons. He isn't the playmaker Miller is, he's hardly a comparable rebounder, and comparing them as shooters is insulting.

 

Pietrus obviously has the edge in the defensive department, but offense? Please.

 

And I find it humorous that some have pulled the "loser" card into this discussion. So what, now Miller's case is harmed by circumstance? Most of his seasons as a "loser" were spent with Pau Gasol and Jason Williams. Are those guys losers, too?

 

My Goodness.

 

just based on age alone i'm not on the miller train, dude's older, and more injury prone, i know peitrus has his bouts, but miller goes down alot.

[God hates Magic fans 0]

ok and who do we get rid of to accomodate these guys? JJ and Barnes?

[Darthmagic 0]

 

You are either a UF homer, a racist, or are on hallucinogenic drugs.

 

Mike Miller does nothing at all better than Pietrus, and is certainly not a better defender or rebounder than Barnes.

 

It could be argued that now that Barnes is in the starting lineup that he isn't even a better shooter than him either.

 

miller is a better offensive player...

 

Than Pietrus?

 

How so? Because he averages more points on a team that is 200x worse?

 

Mike Miller can never and will never be as valuable to a championship caliber basketball team as Mikael Pietrus is. Pietrus could average 20 on a really ****ty team too - where he's chucking up all sorts of shots.

 

I remember Mike Miller being here and scoring points, but I also remember Mike Miller dribbling the ball of his foot into the stands in crucial situations, and turning the ball over carelessly also. I want no part of him or IR-Mac.

 

 

He's a far superior playmaker and 3 point shooter then both of them and it is so obvious it isn't even funny. Pietrus may be more athletic but he discounts that by making so many moronic plays that I will take Miller's bball IQ over Pietrus' athleticism any day. There both always nursing some kind of injury so that's a push. On ball d Pietrus may be better but again he makes so many mental mistakes that Miller simply does not.

 

You point out Miller dribbling the ball off his foot. Valid. Back in 2002 anyway. Kid was in his first years so of course he was making some bad mistakes. By your reckoning we should have given up on Dwight years ago.

 

Now I will agree with you on Barnes in a heartbeat. But if it is between peaches and Miller then I'm sorry, there are very few teams that would take the french-men over the vet.

 

i disagree. pietrus has established that he can be a two-way player. the fact that he plays great defense makes him more valuable.

 

You just tend to overrate your college teams players. A lot.

 

I agree with the 2 way player assessment.

 

Pietrus >>> Miller

 

In what universe?

 

in the universe where basketball is played on two ends of the court.

 

 

we can't use the Defense is just as important as offense when making dwight's case for MVP then dismiss it when people want to overrate miller.

 

The fact is, its easy to find guys who can score. We have several guys on our team who can fill the roll of 4th or 5th option on offense. We dont have as many who can be a top level defender.

 

Thus my reasoning behind why pietrus would be more valuable on this team than mike miller.

 

I'm not ignoring the defensive side of the ball, but IMO Mike Miller gives you more on the offensive end than Peaches gives you on the defensive end. Include the bball IQ it's no contest. Outside of athleticism JJ is a better player than Peaches. I'd take Mike Miller over JJ right now. If JJ became mike miller he would have had a successful career outside of championships. Mike has won rookie of the year and 6th man of the year. The guy's a baller and seriously underrated on this team. As for fit on this team, i wouldn't give up Peaches for him.

[UBBALLER8 248]

quote:

Originally posted by ThisIsTheYear:

There's an inordinate amount of baseless comments in this thread. Pietrus never has, nor will he ever be, the offensive player Mike Miller was/is. Discounting one season, his final season with the Magic where he was forced upon becoming our 2nd scoring option, Mike has never shot below 43%. Pietrus, by contrast, has only shot above this clip three times in seven seasons. He isn't the playmaker Miller is, he's hardly a comparable rebounder, and comparing them as shooters is insulting.

 

Pietrus obviously has the edge in the defensive department, but offense? Please.

 

And I find it humorous that some have pulled the "loser" card into this discussion. So what, now Miller's case is harmed by circumstance? Most of his seasons as a "loser" were spent with Pau Gasol and Jason Williams. Are those guys losers, too?

 

My Goodness.

 

Whoa, whoa whoa... slow down.

 

Mike Miller is a playmaker?

 

Pau Gasol was the only reason those Memphis teams were worth a **** when he was there. He also went to two championships with the Lakers and even won one.

 

Jason Williams won a championship with the Heat and was a humongous contributor on those early playoff Kings teams.

 

How far has Mike Miller been in the playoffs again?

 

Please notify me when Mike Miller makes it to the finals and is an integral part of the team like J Will and Pau were and are currently.

[Darthmagic 0]

quote:

Originally posted by UBBALLER8:

quote:

Originally posted by Lewis4thewin:

quote:

Originally posted by Darthmagic:

quote:

Originally posted by UBBALLER8:

quote:

Originally posted by Darthmagic:

quote:

Originally posted by UBBALLER8:

quote:

Originally posted by Lewis4thewin:

quote:

Originally posted by Ramsde68:

quote:

Originally posted by UBBALLER8:

quote:

Originally posted by Lewis4thewin:

quote:

Originally posted by UBBALLER8:

quote:

Originally posted by Mat

[UBBALLER8 248]

quote:

Originally posted by Darthmagic:

I'm not ignoring the defensive side of the ball, but IMO Mike Miller gives you more on the offensive end than Peaches gives you on the defensive end. Include the bball IQ it's no contest. Outside of athleticism JJ is a better player than Peaches. I'd take Mike Miller over JJ right now. If JJ became mike miller he would have had a successful career outside of championships. Mike has won rookie of the year and 6th man of the year. The guy's a baller and seriously underrated on this team. Ads for fit on this team, i wouldn't give up Peaches for him.

 

Miller over JJ at this point is even laughable for what the Magic need, and what wins games.

 

And believe me, I've ripped on JJ quite a few times on here. JJ is far better than Miller at this point.

[UBBALLER8 248]

quote:

Originally posted by Darthmagic:

quote:

Originally posted by UBBALLER8:

quote:

Originally posted by Lewis4thewin:

quote:

Originally posted by Darthmagic:

quote:

Originally posted by UBBALLER8:

quote:

Originally posted by Darthmagic:

quote:

Originally posted by UBBALLER8:

quote:

Originally posted by Lewis4thewin:

quote:

Originally posted by Ramsde68:

quote:

Originally posted by UBBALLER8:

quote:

Originally posted by Lewis4thewin:

quote:

Originally posted by UBBALLER8:

quote:

Originally posted by Mat

[ThisIsTheYear 241]

quote:

just based on age alone i'm not on the miller train, dude's older, and more injury prone, i know peitrus has his bouts, but miller goes down alot.

 

Miller's as old as Barnes, meaning, he just turned 30. For a guy that relies on shooting, 30's not exactly one of his final twilight years as a player.

 

He's injury prone? Assuming he finishes off his final four games this season without getting inured, Miller has averaged 69 games played per season since the beginning of his NBA career. MP, by contrast, has averaged 62 games played. Who's injury prone again?

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

quote:

Originally posted by Darthmagic:

 

You are either a UF homer, a racist, or are on hallucinogenic drugs.

 

Mike Miller does nothing at all better than Pietrus, and is certainly not a better defender or rebounder than Barnes.

 

It could be argued that now that Barnes is in the starting lineup that he isn't even a better shooter than him either.

 

miller is a better offensive player...

 

Than Pietrus?

 

How so? Because he averages more points on a team that is 200x worse?

 

Mike Miller can never and will never be as valuable to a championship caliber basketball team as Mikael Pietrus is. Pietrus could average 20 on a really ****ty team too - where he's chucking up all sorts of shots.

 

I remember Mike Miller being here and scoring points, but I also remember Mike Miller dribbling the ball of his foot into the stands in crucial situations, and turning the ball over carelessly also. I want no part of him or IR-Mac.

 

 

He's a far superior playmaker and 3 point shooter then both of them and it is so obvious it isn't even funny. Pietrus may be more athletic but he discounts that by making so many moronic plays that I will take Miller's bball IQ over Pietrus' athleticism any day. There both always nursing some kind of injury so that's a push. On ball d Pietrus may be better but again he makes so many mental mistakes that Miller simply does not.

 

You point out Miller dribbling the ball off his foot. Valid. Back in 2002 anyway. Kid was in his first years so of course he was making some bad mistakes. By your reckoning we should have given up on Dwight years ago.

 

Now I will agree with you on Barnes in a heartbeat. But if it is between peaches and Miller then I'm sorry, there are very few teams that would take the french-men over the vet.

 

i disagree. pietrus has established that he can be a two-way player. the fact that he plays great defense makes him more valuable.

 

You just tend to overrate your college teams players. A lot.

 

I agree with the 2 way player assessment.

 

Pietrus >>> Miller

 

In what universe?

 

in the universe where basketball is played on two ends of the court.

 

 

we can't use the Defense is just as important as offense when making dwight's case for MVP then dismiss it when people want to overrate miller.

 

The fact is, its easy to find guys who can score. We have several guys on our team who can fill the roll of 4th or 5th option on offense. We dont have as many who can be a top level defender.

 

Thus my reasoning behind why pietrus would be more valuable on this team than mike miller.

 

I'm not ignoring the defensive side of the ball, but IMO Mike Miller gives you more on the offensive end than Peaches gives you on the defensive end. Include the bball IQ it's no contest. Outside of athleticism JJ is a better player than Peaches. I'd take Mike Miller over JJ right now. If JJ became mike miller he would have had a successful career outside of championships. Mike has won rookie of the year and 6th man of the year. The guy's a baller and seriously underrated on this team. Ads for fit on this team, i wouldn't give up Peaches for him.

 

See, the same people who would have JJ over pietrus like miller over pietrus. These people dont have championship ambitions. JJ is a great player, JJ can win games by himself occasionally while pietrus cant. JJ also cant play in certain playoff series because of his defense.

 

While pietrus may never be the offensive threat that JJ or mike miller is, he is more important on a championship team.

 

The average JJ offensive game and the average Pietrus offensive game is pretty negligible. Pietrus' defense is way more important though.

 

If im building a team and i need a 4th or 5th option im picking pietrus every time because his investment is always worth double because he excels at both offense and defense. JJ and Miller have higher offensive ceilings but need shots for that to happen. Unless they are 2nd or third scoring options out there your return of investment doesn't beat Pietrus.

[PNuT1423 0]

quote:

Originally posted by ThisIsTheYear:

quote:

just based on age alone i'm not on the miller train, dude's older, and more injury prone, i know peitrus has his bouts, but miller goes down alot.

 

Miller's as old as Barnes, meaning, he just turned 30. For a guy that relies on shooting, 30's not exactly one of his final twilight years as a player.

 

He's injury prone? Assuming he finishes off his final four games this season without getting inured, Miller has averaged 69 games played per season since the beginning of his NBA career. MP, by contrast, has averaged 62 games played. Who's injury prone again?

 

 

lol you saw him last night, he was wrapped up more than jareth at a hong kong ***** house.

[Darthmagic 0]

quote:

Originally posted by ThisIsTheYear:

quote:

just based on age alone i'm not on the miller train, dude's older, and more injury prone, i know peitrus has his bouts, but miller goes down alot.

 

Miller's as old as Barnes, meaning, he just turned 30. For a guy that relies on shooting, 30's not exactly one of his final twilight years as a player.

 

He's injury prone? Assuming he finishes off his final four games this season without getting inured, Miller has averaged 69 games played per season since the beginning of his NBA career. MP, by contrast, has averaged 62 games played. Who's injury prone again?

 

It's amazing that people can compare Peaches to Mike Miller. I'm at a loss as to how people think Peaches can come close to Miller's all around game. Peaches can't even dribble three times without traveling.