2016-2017 Season Discussion Thread

[Ibn Battuta 127]

From a pure value standpoint saric is preferable to Payton right now. Not sure saric fits on this team though

 

We need a stretch 4. It's why we can't play Vucevic and Biyombo. Ibaka and Biyombo makes sense, and so would some combination of Ibaka/Biyombo and Saric.

[Soul Bro 1,422]

But at least Payton has that hair

[Magicman28 295]

I can't either. Sadly we had Saric (for about 5 seconds) and traded him away for the guy you're telling us to be patient over. I mean these are your words:

 

"You just got to remind yourself the solid picks we have picked in certain drafts and Porzingis"

 

We never picked Porzingis bro. But I guess we should give credit to Rob for thinking about picking him??? There is no way you can dumb anything down for me.

 

It was Rob's guy. He was going to pick him. If you do the research, you'll see that. It's noteworthy.

 

I'd take one Porzingis over 2 Sarics.

 

It's not worth pondering about Saric who's not even relevant currently. This isn't Paul Pierce, Danny Granger, KLeonard, etc.

[Magicman28 295]

From a pure value standpoint saric is preferable to Payton right now. Not sure saric fits on this team though

 

 

Because he shoots threes. If Payton shoots more efficiently and accurately, consistently, Payton instantly has more value.

[Ibn Battuta 127]

It was Rob's guy. He was going to pick him. If you do the research, you'll see that. It's noteworthy.

 

I'd take one Porzingis over 2 Sarics.

 

It's not worth pondering about Saric who's not even relevant currently. This isn't Paul Pierce, Danny Granger, KLeonard, etc.

 

I'm going to take the next logical step:

 

If our GM felt so strongly about him as you say, why did he not make a move, ANY move, to trade up one spot? Is #5 plus Oladipo plus Payton plus future picks plus taking back a contract not enough? Because at this point I believe many fans would have given up the kitchen sink to have him. If you have a quote from the GM that says what you claim then you would be right and I would absolutely rethink it over.

 

I agree, Saric isn't worth pondering right now because he hasn't stepped on the court. But we did draft him first and he will be compared to Payton for obvious reasons. It's a very fair comparison to make.

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

We need a stretch 4. It's why we can't play Vucevic and Biyombo. Ibaka and Biyombo makes sense, and so would some combination of Ibaka/Biyombo and Saric.

 

eh, Ibaka is our stretch 4. I think if we had saric and Gordon we don't get Ibaka and I don't think Saric right now is good enough on defense to help Vucevic.

 

Hypothetically, if we go Gordon-saric we probably take Mudiay in 2015 and we're at least having similar versions of the same conversations we're having with Payton (with more optimism because we haven't seen year two of Mudiay).

 

The really interesting thing two or three years from now might be exum saric vs Gordon payton.

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

I'm going to take the next logical step:

 

If our GM felt so strongly about him as you say, why did he not make a move, ANY move, to trade up one spot? Is #5 plus Oladipo plus Payton plus future picks plus taking back a contract not enough? Because at this point I believe many fans would have given up the kitchen sink to have him. If you have a quote from the GM that says what you claim then you would be right and I would absolutely rethink it over.

 

I agree, Saric isn't worth pondering right now because he hasn't stepped on the court. But we did draft him first and he will be compared to Payton for obvious reasons.

 

I don't think it's debatable that we were heavily interested in Porzingis. Woj reported that we were pressuring him to stay in the 2014 draft so we could take him. Woj's source was Porzingis' agent.

[Ibn Battuta 127]

I'm not going to get caught up in the he said-she said because ACTIONS speak louder than words. If Rob felt that strongly about him why did he not make a move? Even with hindsight nobody today would be complaining about the kings ransom we would have given to get him. It didn't happen and it's not relevant any more that Rob thought highly of him. Any one of us can sit around and think all day; Rob is getting paid to make those moves.

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

I'm not going to get caught up in the he said-she said because ACTIONS speak louder than words. If Rob felt that strongly about him why did he not make a move? Even with hindsight nobody today would be complaining about the kings ransom we would have given to get him. It didn't happen and it's not relevant any more that Rob thought highly of him. Any one of us can sit around and think all day; Rob is getting paid to make those moves.

 

For the longest time, too, Porzingis' camp had reason to believe he was destined to play for the Orlando Magic. Porzingis entered his name into the 2014 NBA draft with an expectation that he would withdraw prior to the deadline. "Just to get my name out there in the NBA, get some attention," Porzingis said.

 

He was still so raw and rail thin at 7-foot in the Spanish ACB League. Everyone in the NBA scouted Porzingis closely, but few teams outside of Magic GM Rob Hennigan's front office made Porzingis such a significant priority.

 

As an organization, the Magic became enamored with the long-term possibilities of Porzingis and became aggressive in persuading him to remain in the 2014 draft. So aggressive, in fact, Miller worked a guarantee out of Hennigan that Orlando would choose Porzingis with the No. 12 pick in 2014. Orlando owned two picks, including No. 4. If Porzingis preferred to play one more year with Sevilla in the Spanish ACB before coming to the NBA, the Magic would support him.

 

"Rob had a thorough, comprehensive plan," Miller told The Vertical. "He had invested as much, or more time, into Kristaps as anyone in the league. He really studied him. They had a plan for supplemental training, development. It wasn't just, 'Let's just draft him and see what happens.' This was a plan. Kristaps knew the plan and just wasn't ready."

 

It never did sway Porzingis. He had a vision of his future, a plan of how he imagined it would play out, and that didn't include making the leap to the NBA only because a team had a willingness to choose him in the lottery. Porzingis told his brother Janis and Miller: Next year, I'll be ready. Not yet.

 

Hennigan was heartbroken, but a part of him admired the maturity and staying power of Porzingis' decision. In a lot of ways, it reaffirmed the reasons Hennigan felt his front office had been right about the prospect. The kid had substance, principle.

 

After Porzingis' pro day workout in Las Vegas this June – a public workout for all 30 NBA teams – Hennigan felt empty walking out of the gymnasium. This time, Orlando had the fifth pick in the 2015 draft. And he believed his chances of getting Porzingis had evaporated. "He won't get past four," Hennigan told friends on his way out of the workout.

 

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/the-unlikely-story-of-how-kristaps-porzingis-found-his-way-to-the-knicks-072828935.html

 

 

maybe a move wasn't there

[Ibn Battuta 127]

Thanks for posting that. It's great background knowledge. I'm just even more puzzled now if the team had spent all this time with a plan and coming empty handed. Everything has a price and there's always a move to make; These are young adults with developing brains/bodies being drafted and that will always be a factor. I wouldn't have batted an eye if Rob gave up multiple picks and players especially after reading that

[Magicman28 295]

I'm going to take the next logical step:

 

If our GM felt so strongly about him as you say, why did he not make a move, ANY move, to trade up one spot? Is #5 plus Oladipo plus Payton plus future picks plus taking back a contract not enough? Because at this point I believe many fans would have given up the kitchen sink to have him. If you have a quote from the GM that says what you claim then you would be right and I would absolutely rethink it over.

 

I agree, Saric isn't worth pondering right now because he hasn't stepped on the court. But we did draft him first and he will be compared to Payton for obvious reasons.

 

 

Phil needed to bring in an young talent to make some noise. An 20 year old 7'3 shot blocking, rebounding PF that shoots threes, shoots step backs, shoots off the dribble and can put it on the floor while doing so with the agility of an SF will do that. He isn't going to trade that for 2 guards who can't shoot.

 

No GM is going to come out and say "He was our number 1 guy" unless they actually drafted the guy. He would be devaluing Mario with that comment if there was an possible deal in the future. It also doesn't make the player you drafted feel very confident about his situation.

 

What Rob did do was scout him years ago and tried to bring him over in previous drafts. Rob also had more than one interview with him before the actual draft. Phil got curious and scheduled an workout after the fact.

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

Thanks for posting that. It's great background knowledge. I'm just even more puzzled now if the team had spent all this time with a plan and coming empty handed. Everything has a price and there's always a move to make; These are young adults with developing brains/bodies being drafted and that will always be a factor. I wouldn't have batted an eye if Rob gave up multiple picks and players especially after reading that

 

I guess it's managing risk.

 

Cant put all your eggs in one basket. Darko looked like a hall of famer in workouts too.

 

You're right though, it's kinda pointless to discuss hennigan by giving him credit for Porzingis. Though I'd also argue almost every move Hennigan has made has been a net positive move with the exception of the harris trade and payton. But we still have time to see what Payton can do.