MVP Rankings (NBA.com)

[~O~ 565]

It is not a stretch. All you have to do is compare the Lakers from 2006 to the Lakers of 2010. What's the difference? He has wayyyyyy more help, but he can still explode for 35 points on any given night. He averaged somewhere around that in the WCF against the Suns. If he wasn't injured, he would have easily averaged more ppg. He is getting older yes, but just because his numbers aren't close to what they once were doesn't mean he is declining.

[Secretly Space Jesus 670]

It is not a stretch. All you have to do is compare the Lakers from 2006 to the Lakers of 2010. What's the difference? He has wayyyyyy more help, but he can still explode for 35 points on any given night. He averaged somewhere around that in the WCF against the Suns. If he wasn't injured, he would have easily averaged more ppg. He is getting older yes, but just because his numbers aren't close to what they once were doesn't mean he is declining.

 

More help on your team should make you more efficient, not less so.

 

And even were that not the case, his team's makeup has been fairly consistent for the last 3 years, and his efficiency is declined over that period, and was doing so even before he hurt his hand.

 

I don't know why you're even arguing this. He'll be 32 when the season starts. He's declining.

 

Adding a post game will help save his legs somewhat, and might stretch that decline over an additional year or two, but he clearly has, at most, 2 years left at being a top 6 player, and he might very well not have that. Between the regular season and the playoffs, he's played 45k career minutes. It's not like we're saying something that's unfair to Kobe.

[BMP 424]

It is not a stretch. All you have to do is compare the Lakers from 2006 to the Lakers of 2010. What's the difference? He has wayyyyyy more help, but he can still explode for 35 points on any given night. He averaged somewhere around that in the WCF against the Suns. If he wasn't injured, he would have easily averaged more ppg. He is getting older yes, but just because his numbers aren't close to what they once were doesn't mean he is declining.

 

 

This is why I decided not to make an emphasis on his scoring numbers and used his efficiency numbers (true shooting percentages).

 

Him being older and his numbers going down is exactly what a decline is (for an NBA player). You act as if I'm saying he'll be terrible next season. No, he'll just not be as good. And the same for the next year, and the next year. If Kobe plays around the same minutes he did last year (and around the same amount of games), he will have more minutes played than Michael Jordan. MJ himself was on a decline during his second 3peat. Add all those minutes up to the fact that Kobe has a permanent damage on his finger, is getting older, and seems to be getting to the line less and less, and baby you've got a stew going.

[Lakers243 2]

More help on your team should make you more efficient, not less so.

 

And even were that not the case, his team's makeup has been fairly consistent for the last 3 years, and his efficiency is declined over that period, and was doing so even before he hurt his hand.

 

I don't know why you're even arguing this. He'll be 32 when the season starts. He's declining.

 

Adding a post game will help save his legs somewhat, and might stretch that decline over an additional year or two, but he clearly has, at most, 2 years left at being a top 6 player, and he might very well not have that. Between the regular season and the playoffs, he's played 45k career minutes. It's not like we're saying something that's unfair to Kobe.

Lol his efficiency was not declining before he hurt his hand, he was dominating with his post game early last season and was scoring at will. You also say he has 2 years left at being a top 6 player? Funny, because I recall 2 years ago people were saying he had 2 years left at being a top 6 player. Not only is he a top 6 player, he IS the top player, still. "It's not like we are saying something unfair to Kobe"... that sounds pretty unfair to me lol. Kobe can still have an MVP season and he is still the best player in the game. That's why he is at the top of the MVP rankings right now, why does it seem like such a shock to you guys? Even if he is declining slightly as time goes by, there is no doubt he can perform at the highest level for a full season should he stay healthy. Not saying he will, but he can do it. Look you guys we can have our disagreements, but whoever is doing these rankings seem to agree with me.

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

Lol his efficiency was not declining before he hurt his hand, he was dominating with his post game early last season and was scoring at will. You also say he has 2 years left at being a top 6 player? Funny, because I recall 2 years ago people were saying he had 2 years left at being a top 6 player. Not only is he a top 6 player, he IS the top player, still. "It's not like we are saying something unfair to Kobe"... that sounds pretty unfair to me lol. Kobe can still have an MVP season and he is still the best player in the game. That's why he is at the top of the MVP rankings right now, why does it seem like such a shock to you guys? Even if he is declining slightly as time goes by, there is no doubt he can perform at the highest level for a full season should he stay healthy. Not saying he will, but he can do it. Look you guys we can have our disagreements, but whoever is doing these rankings seem to agree with me.

 

you can look at any legit hall of famer's career and compare it to kobe if you want. He's already played more games than Jordan and Bird.

 

The injuries are his decline. He can reinvent himself however many times he wants but all I know is he wont be the same scary good player he was two years from now after more deep playoff runs and another 150 reg season games. It just doesn't happen.

[Secretly Space Jesus 670]

Lol his efficiency was not declining before he hurt his hand, he was dominating with his post game early last season and was scoring at will. You also say he has 2 years left at being a top 6 player? Funny, because I recall 2 years ago people were saying he had 2 years left at being a top 6 player. Not only is he a top 6 player, he IS the top player, still. "It's not like we are saying something unfair to Kobe"... that sounds pretty unfair to me lol. Kobe can still have an MVP season and he is still the best player in the game. That's why he is at the top of the MVP rankings right now, why does it seem like such a shock to you guys? Even if he is declining slightly as time goes by, there is no doubt he can perform at the highest level for a full season should he stay healthy. Not saying he will, but he can do it. Look you guys we can have our disagreements, but whoever is doing these rankings seem to agree with me.

 

So in response to something I wrote based off year's of league history is "Nuh-uh!"

 

Awesome. I'm so glad we're getting random trolls from other teams now.

[BMP 424]

Lol his efficiency was not declining before he hurt his hand, he was dominating with his post game early last season and was scoring at will. You also say he has 2 years left at being a top 6 player? Funny, because I recall 2 years ago people were saying he had 2 years left at being a top 6 player. Not only is he a top 6 player, he IS the top player, still. "It's not like we are saying something unfair to Kobe"... that sounds pretty unfair to me lol. Kobe can still have an MVP season and he is still the best player in the game. That's why he is at the top of the MVP rankings right now, why does it seem like such a shock to you guys? Even if he is declining slightly as time goes by, there is no doubt he can perform at the highest level for a full season should he stay healthy. Not saying he will, but he can do it. Look you guys we can have our disagreements, but whoever is doing these rankings seem to agree with me.

 

He has a permanent damage to his finger, it's never going to be healthy again.

 

There aren't many arguments to be made here. Kobe's effiency has dropped in the past 4 years, as well as rebounding (3 years) and win shares. It's not rocket science that's he on a decline (as he should be, especially for the amount of minutes he has already played).

 

If the trend continues, Kobe's numbers next year will be worse than this year (even if slighty) and Durant's will be better. Durant already had more votes in the MVP voting than Kobe this year, so with better numbers (and less from Kobe), it shouldn't even be a surprise to see him winning the MVP.

 

 

Kobe's at the top of MVP rankings made by some guy, that doesn't mean he should be at the top. I'll even go as far as saying that if Howard got as many touches as Kobe did, he'd be the one winning MVP, not Durant. There's no doubt in my mind Howard could average 25 points on at least 55% shooting, 13+ rebounds, and 2+ blocks, and those numbers would be enough to beat Kobe in the MVP voting.

 

 

Now, just because this is something I believe, it doesn't mean it'll happen, and it's why I don't think Howard will win the MVP voting. The Magic team is full of guys that need the ball, so in order for Howard to get that many touches/points, other guys on the team would have to suffer, and he defers to teammates way too much to do that.

 

 

Just like, no matter how much you believe it, Kobe just isn't going to be healthy enough OR efficient enough to be able to have better numbers than Durant. The MVP voting is mostly based on plain stats and team success. It doesn't take into account advanced stats or role on the team. It's purely a popularity contest, and guess what? If TEAM USA has any type of success this year, Durant will overshadow almost every superstar in the league, no matter how many rings they have.

 

 

 

Look at this way: Even if Kobe shot 50% last season, he still would've lost the MVP voting to LeBron because LeBron would've accumulated more assists and more rebounds.

[TheBlackMamba 0]

How the hell does Kobe go from 3rd last year to 1st next year? Durant had more votes last year and if anything, will only get better, whereas Kobe seems to be in a steady decline. LeBron's stats may suffer from playing on the Heat, but keep in mind the guy was 7 votes away from being voted unanimously and had 600 more points than Durant. Also, according to him, "it's not about sharing".

 

 

Kobe will be lucky to be in the top 3 again.

Kobe declining ? Obviously someone didn't watch Kobe the last 3 seasons.

 

Kobe has stayed at 27/28 ppg, 5 assists, 5 rebounds, and his career average of 45 %.

 

In the playoffs he's gotten even better as far as points.

 

He clearly hasn't declined. All that will a load of injuries particually last year.

 

Dude is still head and shoulders the best player in the NBA and he'll remain that way at least for two more seasons if healthy.

[Lakers243 2]

So in response to something I wrote based off year's of league history is "Nuh-uh!"

 

Awesome. I'm so glad we're getting random trolls from other teams now.

What I can't come into another teams forum and give my two cents on something I'm right about? Did I ever say anything bad about the Magic? Relax bro. Now you can go ahead and say, oh just a stupid Laker fan, but never underestimate Kobe Bryant.

 

Kobe declining ? Obviously someone didn't watch Kobe the last 3 seasons.

 

Kobe has stayed at 27/28 ppg, 5 assists, 5 rebounds, and his career average of 45 %.

 

In the playoffs he's gotten even better as far as points.

 

He clearly hasn't declined. All that will a load of injuries particually last year.

 

Dude is still head and shoulders the best player in the NBA and he'll remain that way at least for two more seasons if healthy.

Boom. Thank You.

[BMP 424]

 

 

To say a 32-year old who has played over 45k minutes with permanent damage on his finger, along factual data that shows his efficiency numbers and win shares dropping isn't on the decline is just stupid.

 

 

Kobe has gone from 35.4 points to 31.6 points to 28.3 points to 26.8 points to 27 points (.2 more than the season before but on more shot attempts, so it's also less).

 

 

Believe it or not, that's a decline. It's going down. Season after season he will be older and although "wiser", less athletic and explosiveness. It may not be a significant drop (or it may be), but how the hell do you guys honestly make a case for this? Leave your subjective bullcrap out of it. You're just like most VC fans. You'll stand behind the guy no matter what. Kobe is no longer the best player in the league and he wasn't the best player in the league a year ago, and he sure as hell will not be the best player in the league next year.

 

 

Oh, and I'm not even talking about MVP voting.

[T-MAC 1]

1. Kevin Durant

 

2. Dwight Howard

 

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[Lakers243 2]

 

 

To say a 32-year old who has played over 45k minutes with permanent damage on his finger, along factual data that shows his efficiency numbers and win shares dropping isn't on the decline is just stupid.

 

 

Kobe has gone from 35.4 points to 31.6 points to 28.3 points to 26.8 points to 27 points (.2 more than the season before but on more shot attempts, so it's also less).

 

 

Believe it or not, that's a decline. It's going down. Season after season he will be older and although "wiser", less athletic and explosiveness. It may not be a significant drop (or it may be), but how the hell do you guys honestly make a case for this? Leave your subjective bullcrap out of it. You're just like most VC fans. You'll stand behind the guy no matter what. Kobe is no longer the best player in the league and he wasn't the best player in the league a year ago, and he sure as hell will not be the best player in the league next year. Oh, and I'm not even talking about MVP voting.

Lol, the best player in the game is not about averages. First we are talking about the MVP award which is solely based on statistics, which Kobe can still win next season, and now you wanna argue that Kobe Bryant is not the best player in the game? Wow. Do you think the best player in basketball is based on statistics? Haha. Lets see, Kobe still averages in the top 3 in statistics in the regular season and then ups that in the playoffs every year. That's just stats. He has 5 rings. 1 MVP. 2 Finals MVP's. No one in the league comes close to that. His work ethic, leadership, focus, drive and ability to overcome adversity time and time and time again are completely unmatched by any one in the league today and that will remain true. The only other player ever to have those attributes on the same level as Kobe was MJ. Durant is a stud, no doubt, but not on the same level as Kobe. If the best player in the game was solely based by your logic, statistics, Queen James or whoever can have their trophy. The big boys come to play in the postseason. And you're right. I will stand by him. I'm a diehard Laker fan. But it's not hard to see that Kobe Bryant is the best player in the league and the world. You deny that, you're a hater, plain and simple.