Anyone feel sorry for Vince?

[Butterfly 3]

quote:

Originally posted by Ramsde68:

quote:

Originally posted by Miller4Prez64:

Why must Vince Carter fanboys have to find ways to blame everyone else for Vince's god awful play?

 

He averaged 15 ppg and shot under 25% from three in the entire playoffs. Jameer didn't make him miss all those shots, he didn't tell him to constantly take contested fade aways, he didn't tell Vince to stop driving to the basket. He was pretty much a train wreck the entire postseason. He couldn't do what we brought him in for and create his own offense. It's too bad we got him past his prime, but it is what it is.

 

I'm no Carter fan (I like the guy though, but I've been a Magic fan for far longer) but I feel like Vince is getting far too much blame for this loss to Boston. No player played consistently well in this series. The whole team showed a lack of heart until the last few games and yet most people point the blame on Carter, a guy who took less shots then all of our other all stars. They call him gutless and heartless when the majority of his shots came inside the paints, getting no benefit from the refs, while Paul Pierce would get a reassuring snuggle and the Refs would call a foul immediately.

 

I will admit he did not get the job done. We needed far more from him. But we also needed more from Rashard. We needed more from our bench. We needed Dwight and Jameer to play like they did later in the series, the WHOLE series. I feel ready to defend him when everyone wants to make him the main scapegoat, which just shows pure ignorance, something I can't stand.

 

 

I really do not think Carter can physically be the player that he was when he first entered the NBA. I know many posters here are in their early twenties, but when a person gets to be in their mid 30's (in this profession) it takes its toll on you. Carter's ankles and knees probably hurt alot. Also, Carter was used to getting Superstar calls when he was playing for NJ that he does not get here. Those Celtics thugs were all over him, and no calls were being made. KG made a goal tend that was not called. This was the first time he was ever in the ECF at 33 or 34, and he froze. When I read that Carter is heartless, this is totally wrong. He had a hospital built for drug addicted people and many many honorable deeds. He came here via trade. He tried hard, but he could not do what people/fans though he should do. All this hate is so unfounded to me.

[RadiantShot 0]

I'll say it once more. Carter lacks the heart, not the skill. If Carter had half the heart Kobe Bryant has, we wouldn't be having this discussion..Come on guys, some of these comments don't make sense. Carter hasn't been impressive, but "He's too old.." Really? He's got to want it. That's it.

[VC_Fan 0]

If you expected him to be "the man" you are just ignorant. Vince Carter is 33 years old. The average NBA career is 4.8 years. Do the math....that means the average player is retired well before the age of 30. Vince "drives to the hoop" and "attacks the basket" probably more than any other 33+ year old in the entire league. Pierce may get more free throw attempts, but that's not because he drives to the hoop, it's because the referees give him BS calls where he jumps into the defender, initiating contact. Those should be no-calls or even offensive fouls. But for some reason they like Pierce (or maybe he has dirt on them and they're afraid to call it like they see it).

[Butterfly 3]

quote:

Carter lacks the heart,

 

 

How would anyone measure this? As long as Carter is in Magic uniform, I will support him. Just wait until you guys get mid 30's and see if you can still play basketball or any other sport the same way.

[RadiantShot 0]

quote:

Originally posted by VC_Fan:

If you expected him to be "the man" you are just ignorant. Vince Carter is 33 years old. The average NBA career is 4.8 years. Do the math....that means the average player is retired well before the age of 30. Vince "drives to the hoop" and "attacks the basket" probably more than any other 33+ year old in the entire league. Pierce may get more free throw attempts, but that's not because he drives to the hoop, it's because the referees give him BS calls where he jumps into the defender, initiating contact. Those should be no-calls or even offensive fouls. But for some reason they like Pierce (or maybe he has dirt on them and they're afraid to call it like they see it).

 

..There's no way that's true at all...Can I see a stat on that please? Link? Most guys play well into their thirties..barring injuries. I don't think you know what you're talking about. Vince can still be 'That man' too. We all know it. It's a matter of, will be he the man, not 'can he?'

[RadiantShot 0]

quote:

Originally posted by AQUARIUM61:

quote:

Carter lacks the heart,

 

 

How would anyone measure this? As long as Carter is in Magic uniform, I will support him. Just wait until you guys get mid 30's and see if you can still play basketball or any other sport the same way.

 

Carter still has all the athleticism in the world...Like he showed us on that 360 dunk. You think MJ could still 360 when he was 33 years old, and on the brink of possible retirement? Definitely not. Vince has all the necessary attributes to keep playing great basketball..But he doesn't have the heart to go out and do it...Passing up the spotlight in the Playoffs..Taking bad shots..Not showing much emoiton at all..That doesn't all equate for success. That's where the heart role comes into play. You wonder why he was benched at the end of Game 4. Not because he couldn't do anything, but because he didn't want to.

[VC_Fan 0]

>>..There's no way that's true at all...Can I see a stat on that please?<<

 

"Of the 329 NBA players included in this study, 133 were listed as guards, 142 were forwards, and 54 were centers. The average length of their NBA careers was 4.81 seasons (SD = 3.69). "

 

http://www.thesportjournal.org...ers-career-longevity

 

That's a sample size of 329 players. I think I'd call that statistically significant.

 

 

>>Most guys play well into their thirties..barring injuries.<<

 

No they don't. The players people remember for years to come may play well into their 30s, but that's the REASON people remember them for years to come. There are countless players whose careers only last 2-3 years.

 

 

>>I don't think you know what you're talking about.<<

 

I don't care what you think. I stated the facts and gave a link to a large-scale study. If you have a better source saying that "most" (more than 50%) player play "well into their 30s" do share.

 

 

Edit: here's another source saying 4.82 years

 

4.82 Length in seasons of the average NBA career

 

http://www.time.com/time/magaz...oglep)#ixzz0pTFvL8Id

[RadiantShot 0]

quote:

Originally posted by VC_Fan:

>>..There's no way that's true at all...Can I see a stat on that please?<<

 

"Of the 329 NBA players included in this study, 133 were listed as guards, 142 were forwards, and 54 were centers. The average length of their NBA careers was 4.81 seasons (SD = 3.69). "

 

http://www.thesportjournal.org...ers-career-longevity

 

That's a sample size of 329 players. I think I'd call that statistically significant.

 

 

>>Most guys play well into their thirties..barring injuries.<<

 

No they don't. The players people remember for years to come may play well into their 30s, but that's the REASON people remember them for years to come. There are countless players whose careers only last 2-3 years.

 

 

>>I don't think you know what you're talking about.<<

 

I don't care what you think. I stated the facts and gave a link to a large-scale study. If you have a better source saying that "most" (more than 50%) player play "well into their 30s" do share.

 

 

Edit: here's another source saying 4.82 years

 

4.82 Length in seasons of the average NBA career

 

http://www.time.com/time/magaz...oglep)#ixzz0pTFvL8Id

 

Fair enough..Just usually see most players playing into their early thirties..Most start in their early-mid 20's, and end early-mid thirties, which would equate to 7-10 seasons...Or 6-9 years...It's all whatever. We all know Vince SHOULD still be capable of what we know he can do...Be a go-to guy. Paul Pierce is still the go-to guy, Kobe Bryant is, Tim Duncan is, etc. Vince can still be listed among those guys when he's playing great.

[VC_Fan 0]

>>Fair enough..Just usually see most players playing into their early thirties<<

 

Again though, that's NOT "most players". That's the guys you remember. You forget about all the guys who just aren't good enough to stay in the league. The guys who maybe play 40-50 games over a 2 year period on D-League call-ups, and are never heard from again. The guys who can't hack it even though they were a top 10 first-round pick, and and up out of the league after three seasons (like Haffa Araujo, #8 overall pick by the Raptors in 2004), and playing in Europe or South America.

 

 

>>Paul Pierce is still the go-to guy<<

 

But you can't deny the reason he is still so efficient is because of the questionable calls he gets. Why do you think he averages so many free throws? It's not because he's athletic, or even aggressive driving the ball. It's because of those often questionable calls he gets on pump fakes and jumping into defenders. Surely you saw that this series.

[GhostAnime 50]

quote:

Originally posted by AQUARIUM61:

quote:

Carter lacks the heart,

 

 

How would anyone measure this? As long as Carter is in Magic uniform, I will support him. Just wait until you guys get mid 30's and see if you can still play basketball or any other sport the same way.

why do you always backpedal and contradict yourself? it's like a different person posts from your computer every day.

[RadiantShot 0]

quote:

Originally posted by VC_Fan:

>>Fair enough..Just usually see most players playing into their early thirties<<

 

Again though, that's NOT "most players". That's the guys you remember. You forget about all the guys who just aren't good enough to stay in the league. The guys who maybe play 40-50 games over a 2 year period on D-League call-ups, and are never heard from again. The guys who can't hack it even though they were a top 10 first-round pick, and and up out of the league after three seasons (like Haffa Araujo, #8 overall pick by the Raptors in 2004), and playing in Europe or South America.

 

 

>>Paul Pierce is still the go-to guy<<

 

But you can't deny the reason he is still so efficient is because of the questionable calls he gets. Why do you think he averages so many free throws? It's not because he's athletic, or even aggressive driving the ball. It's because of those often questionable calls he gets on pump fakes and jumping into defenders. Surely you saw that this series.

 

On the Paul Pierce comment...That's a whole nother' thing we're dealing with. I do recognize that some of his calls are questionable, but I'm talking about, 'in the clutch.' He's still coming up big when his team needs it. He averaged 24 PPG, on 51% FG against us..He came up big. Carter didn't. Just because Carter didn't though, doesn't mean he can't.

[ApexTurbo 6]

I think that Vince tried, but mentally he is extremely weak. He gave it his all physically but mentally I think he quit in January.