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CTMagicUK

2021 NBA Draft Thread

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Terrence Shannon and Marcus Bagley going back to school has thinned the wing prospects in the second round some. Neither of those guys were super high on my wishlist at #33 if we keep it but it does make it more likely that a guy I do like gets taken before us. 

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5 hours ago, CTMagicUK said:

Terrence Shannon and Marcus Bagley going back to school has thinned the wing prospects in the second round some. Neither of those guys were super high on my wishlist at #33 if we keep it but it does make it more likely that a guy I do like gets taken before us. 

Johnny Juzang too. 

 

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11 minutes ago, CTMagicUK said:

Johnny Juzang too. 

 

NBADRAFT.NET updated on July 6 their mock:

@ 33 - Greg Brown 6'9 Forward from Texas

@ 5 - Scottie Barnes

@ 8 - Keon Johnson  ( It has the Warriors taking Bouknight @ 7 )

 

 

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46 minutes ago, Albert Lergier said:

NBADRAFT.NET updated on July 6 their mock:

@ 33 - Greg Brown 6'9 Forward from Texas

@ 5 - Scottie Barnes

@ 8 - Keon Johnson  ( It has the Warriors taking Bouknight @ 7 )

 

 

NBA draft.net is usually terrible anyway which bodes well because I do not like this draft. 

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14 hours ago, ROCK LEGENDS PHOTOGRAPHERS said:

We'd all like to know that prior to the trades we made what you would have done to make our team better?

Because I'm not typing it out twice, I will copy and paste what I wrote in the other thread:

"

We were a playoff team the 2 years prior.

We had an all-star center that we could build around.

We had young, up and coming talent in the form of not 1, not 2, not 3, but *four* lottery caliber picks all under the age of 23 (Markelle Fultz, Jonathan Isaac, Cole Anthony, Chuma Okeke)

Before the injuries, we had the top record in the Eastern conference, and young players like the ones I mentioned above were either starting (Fultz), or getting *very* significant minutes off the bench (Cole, Chuma), and there was very little drop-off from our first unit to our 2nd unit.

This was a team that, at full health, would have been a very competitive team in the Eastern conference.

What should we have done? Kept Vucevic. Let the year play out, and come back next year re-tooled and at full strength with Fultz and Isaac coming back at some point next year. I would have said keep Fournier and let him expire, because his biggest value was letting his contract come off the books (not trading him for more mediocre talent and keeping the salary on our books), but the front office was able to deal him for draft picks and no returned salary. So I'm fine with that.

I'm even fine with the trade of Gordon, because he was probably gonna get flipped eventually anyways. I liked Gordon, but he didn't seem to be surpassing the level he had reached.

But trading Vucevic and going into full blown intentional tank mode was a step too far. This was a playoff team already, and we had a huge youth core that was already improving, and only going to improve even more. They would have had a legitimate all-star on the roster with them to play alongside, were already proving to be competitive, and already had playoff experience. The roster, as it was constructed, was not a roster that would "peak at a 7th seed and lose in the first round". If the roster is as good as it was ever going to get, then that means you are saying that young players can't and won't develop, and if that is the case, then there is no reason to trade away for multiple draft picks anyways, because they won't be given an opportunity to develop.

But young talent does develop, and already was developing. Fultz was showcasing leadership skills. Cole and Chuma were showing good skills off the bench. We had a roster spot opening up with Fournier's eventual departure for Cole to slide into the starting spot. With Gordon leaving as well, there was even a spot open for Chuma to slide into the starting spot. We could have retooled those bench spots with our #5 pick that we would have had regardless, and paired it all around a legitimate all-star to help guide us to even loftier goals and heights. There was no reason why this roster as constructed couldn't have and wouldn't have competed for high playoff positioning in the Eastern conference. They already were, and the only reason why this season was lost in the first place was because Fultz and Isaac were lost for the year, and Gordon, Fournier, Cole, Chuma, and many others were out for significant periods of the year. We were playing with D-leaguers for good chunks of the year, but this fanbase and the front office put the blame on the roster construction.

Instead, the front office went into full tank mode, traded away our best asset, and now have put the entire burden of this franchise on the shoulders of a bunch of 22 year olds, with no indication of being any good any time soon. We've set ourselves up for at least another half decade of failure by embracing the tanking route and I don't see any path out of this anytime soon."

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3 hours ago, Franchise408 said:

Because I'm not typing it out twice, I will copy and paste what I wrote in the other thread:

"

We were a playoff team the 2 years prior.

We had an all-star center that we could build around.

We had young, up and coming talent in the form of not 1, not 2, not 3, but *four* lottery caliber picks all under the age of 23 (Markelle Fultz, Jonathan Isaac, Cole Anthony, Chuma Okeke)

Before the injuries, we had the top record in the Eastern conference, and young players like the ones I mentioned above were either starting (Fultz), or getting *very* significant minutes off the bench (Cole, Chuma), and there was very little drop-off from our first unit to our 2nd unit.

This was a team that, at full health, would have been a very competitive team in the Eastern conference.

What should we have done? Kept Vucevic. Let the year play out, and come back next year re-tooled and at full strength with Fultz and Isaac coming back at some point next year. I would have said keep Fournier and let him expire, because his biggest value was letting his contract come off the books (not trading him for more mediocre talent and keeping the salary on our books), but the front office was able to deal him for draft picks and no returned salary. So I'm fine with that.

I'm even fine with the trade of Gordon, because he was probably gonna get flipped eventually anyways. I liked Gordon, but he didn't seem to be surpassing the level he had reached.

But trading Vucevic and going into full blown intentional tank mode was a step too far. This was a playoff team already, and we had a huge youth core that was already improving, and only going to improve even more. They would have had a legitimate all-star on the roster with them to play alongside, were already proving to be competitive, and already had playoff experience. The roster, as it was constructed, was not a roster that would "peak at a 7th seed and lose in the first round". If the roster is as good as it was ever going to get, then that means you are saying that young players can't and won't develop, and if that is the case, then there is no reason to trade away for multiple draft picks anyways, because they won't be given an opportunity to develop.

But young talent does develop, and already was developing. Fultz was showcasing leadership skills. Cole and Chuma were showing good skills off the bench. We had a roster spot opening up with Fournier's eventual departure for Cole to slide into the starting spot. With Gordon leaving as well, there was even a spot open for Chuma to slide into the starting spot. We could have retooled those bench spots with our #5 pick that we would have had regardless, and paired it all around a legitimate all-star to help guide us to even loftier goals and heights. There was no reason why this roster as constructed couldn't have and wouldn't have competed for high playoff positioning in the Eastern conference. They already were, and the only reason why this season was lost in the first place was because Fultz and Isaac were lost for the year, and Gordon, Fournier, Cole, Chuma, and many others were out for significant periods of the year. We were playing with D-leaguers for good chunks of the year, but this fanbase and the front office put the blame on the roster construction.

Instead, the front office went into full tank mode, traded away our best asset, and now have put the entire burden of this franchise on the shoulders of a bunch of 22 year olds, with no indication of being any good any time soon. We've set ourselves up for at least another half decade of failure by embracing the tanking route and I don't see any path out of this anytime soon."

I can see your point, but it really depends on whether or not a team built around Vucevic can get you to the top. You apparently believe that it can, but I think a lot of people look at him as a good complementary player, but not a central building block. There are only a couple of teams in the league that have a Center as (arguably) their best player - Denver, Philadelphia, and Minnesota. I'm not sure that Vuc compares favorably with Jokic, or Embiid; and Minnesota was just plain bad, so building around KAT has not really helped them either. 

 

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20 minutes ago, jmmagicfan said:

I can see your point, but it really depends on whether or not a team built around Vucevic can get you to the top. You apparently believe that it can, but I think a lot of people look at him as a good complementary player, but not a central building block. There are only a couple of teams in the league that have a Center as (arguably) their best player - Denver, Philadelphia, and Minnesota. I'm not sure that Vuc compares favorably with Jokic, or Embiid; and Minnesota was just plain bad, so building around KAT has not really helped them either. 

 

Vuc as your best player is like not having a first round pick in a fantasy draft. You’re just never gonna be able to make up for it 

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8 hours ago, Franchise408 said:

 

We had young, up and coming talent in the form of not 1, not 2, not 3, but *four* lottery caliber picks all under the age of 23 (Markelle Fultz, Jonathan Isaac, Cole Anthony, Chuma Okeke)

 

But young talent does develop, and already was developing. Fultz was showcasing leadership skills. Cole and Chuma were showing good skills off the bench. We had a roster spot opening up with Fournier's eventual departure for Cole to slide into the starting spot. With Gordon leaving as well, there was even a spot open for Chuma to slide into the starting spot. We could have retooled those bench spots with our #5 pick that we would have had regardless, and paired it all around a legitimate all-star to help guide us to even loftier goals and heights. There was no reason why this roster as constructed couldn't have and wouldn't have competed for high playoff positioning in the Eastern conference. They already were, and the only reason why this season was lost in the first place was because Fultz and Isaac were lost for the year, and Gordon, Fournier, Cole, Chuma, and many others were out for significant periods of the year. We were playing with D-leaguers for good chunks of the year, but this fanbase and the front office put the blame on the roster construction.

 

So we still have those very same up and coming and soon to develop young players. Yeah we lost Vuc, but his scoring and rebounds will nearly be replaced by someone else. Picking up Hampton, WCJ,  and some picks will allow us to develop a very young and cohesive team. We'll see how it all plays out over the next 2 years.

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30 minutes ago, ROCK LEGENDS PHOTOGRAPHERS said:

So we still have those very same up and coming and soon to develop young players. Yeah we lost Vuc, but his scoring and rebounds will nearly be replaced by someone else. Picking up Hampton and some picks will allow us to develop a very young and cohesive team. We'll see how it all plays out over the next 2 years.

The players aren’t damaged from 30 games of losing either. They aren’t that fragile 

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I wish Vuc the best but I think this will be a better team in the long run. With our team before the trade, I think we peaked and over the next few years we will slowly get worse and young guys like Mo, cole, Okeke would just sit on the bench and rot away. It is why Cliff got let go because he dont want to play the young guys. With a healthy team, we will make it to the playoff this coming year as the 8th and will get bounce. But we will get better over the next 3-5 years and be in the top 3 of the east possibly if our guys continue to develop. 5th pick we need BPA and 8th and 33th need to be shooters.I am very excited of the team if we can develop

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