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2020-2021 General Game Thread

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3 minutes ago, CTMagicUK said:

Neither Clark nor Bacon are guaranteed for next season. 

Thank god. Cheers.

So whats the rules around waiving them? 

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30 minutes ago, harley said:

Thank god. Cheers.

So whats the rules around waiving them? 

If we waive them we'll pay their full salary for this season. With us only having 9 or 10 healthy players and being close to the tax line I can't imagine we'll be waiving them any time soon. Plus they're the type of small contracts we might need to match salaries in trades at the deadline. 

After the deadline we might waive Gary Clark to make room for one of the G-League guys maybe but with this being a lost season anyway we might just wait until the summer to make changes. 

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4 hours ago, CTMagicUK said:

Also I've got so many half written essays this past weekend in response to people bagging on Vuc that I abandoned because I just think it's not worth it now. If you still want to trade Vuc we'll never agree, I'll never convince you and you'll never convince me.

And that’s the beauty of it. We each get to play keyboard gms together. I just want us to get back in the win column. If that comes through keeping Vooch or trading Vooch, I don’t care. Vooch has become an outstanding offensive player... I just want our team to become an outstanding team again.

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On 3/15/2021 at 9:30 AM, CTMagicUK said:

Also I've got so many half written essays this past weekend in response to people bagging on Vuc that I abandoned because I just think it's not worth it now. If you still want to trade Vuc we'll never agree, I'll never convince you and you'll never convince me.

Probably you're right in the sense that we're not going to convince each other.

But what about the other point I'm making recently? If management is convinced, like you and a lot of others, that Nik could be THAT player, what they're waiting for? Surround him with better talent, fit, and make a run when everyone will be healthy again. Trade the expirings for a better player... even future picks if necessary... do...SOMETHING! Just make that decision and find a way out to that limbo we're living in those last few years. Nik is not getting any younger, and even that window is closing if they evaluate a few more time....

Everytime I consider that Nik is not the right guy, I'm not hating him... he's just in the middle of an awful situation, for him personally and for the team we love... the focus of the problem IMO is, and has always been, FO.

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24 minutes ago, Luke_FfS said:

Probably you're right in the sense that we're not going to convince each other.

But what about the other point I'm making recently? If management is convinced, like you and a lot of others, that Nik could be THAT player, what they're waiting for? Surround him with better talent, fit, and make a run when everyone will be healthy again. Trade the expirings for a better player... even future picks if necessary... do...SOMETHING! Just make that decision and find a way out to that limbo we're living in those last few years. Nik is not getting any younger, and even that window is closing if they evaluate a few more time....

Everytime I consider that Nik is not the right guy, I'm not hating him... he's just in the middle of an awful situation, for him personally and for the team we love... the focus of the problem IMO is, and has always been, FO.

This guy gets it! Cheers to this post. The FO are the ones responsible in putting a cohesive team together. They haven’t shown they are capable of coming even close to that and instead rely on excuses/situations to dictate their decision making. Someone is always injured and we always need to wait another year to evaluate what we have. Well how long do we need to sit and wait to evaluate a team that looks the same every night? Like you stated if Vuc is our guy what is management waiting for? We don’t make moves with the hope we grow internally yet don’t play any of our rookies to see if they will actually develop. We have it all backwards and it is starting to seem like a lot more people are finally feeling the same way. 

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45 minutes ago, Luke_FfS said:

Probably you're right in the sense that we're not going to convince each other.

But what about the other point I'm making recently? If management is convinced, like you and a lot of others, that Nik could be THAT player, what they're waiting for? Surround him with better talent, fit, and make a run when everyone will be healthy again. Trade the expirings for a better player... even future picks if necessary... do...SOMETHING! Just make that decision and find a way out to that limbo we're living in those last few years. Nik is not getting any younger, and even that window is closing if they evaluate a few more time....

Everytime I consider that Nik is not the right guy, I'm not hating him... he's just in the middle of an awful situation, for him personally and for the team we love... the focus of the problem IMO is, and has always been, FO.

The problem I see is that I don’t think WeltHam expected Vooch to be this good. Why else would they have drafted Bamba and gone the (very patient) Fultz and Isaac route? So now we’re a team caught with a confused timeline. Are we the patient team that develops Fultz, Isaac, Okeke and Bamba, or we are the team that gives low ceiling vets high minutes in a bid to win now? 

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The irony with the whole Vooch discussion is that the majority of this board would have traded Vooch for just one first rounder a couple of years ago. Huge credit to the big guy for lifting his game.

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On 3/15/2021 at 5:42 AM, CTMagicUK said:

If we waive them we'll pay their full salary for this season. With us only having 9 or 10 healthy players and being close to the tax line I can't imagine we'll be waiving them any time soon. Plus they're the type of small contracts we might need to match salaries in trades at the deadline. 

After the deadline we might waive Gary Clark to make room for one of the G-League guys maybe but with this being a lost season anyway we might just wait until the summer to make changes. 

Spotrac is showing Clark as guaranteed for next year, but Bacon as non-guaranteed. A decision on Bacon has to happen before August, or he becomes guaranteed automatically. 

 https://www.spotrac.com/nba/orlando-magic/cap/2021/.

They are usually pretty accurate, though they do sometimes take a few days to update after a trade or other change. The disabled player exception we received for Fultz has expired (unused, obviously), and the one for Isaac expires 4/17/21. We could possibly waive Clark, and use a portion of that exception to add a non-minimum salary player if someone gets bought out, and not signed elsewhere. Since we are more than half-way through the season, even if we sign someone to the full $3.6M exception, it still wouldn't put us in the tax-payer category, as we'd pay less than half a year's salary. Not sure why we would, or why someone might come here for that, but never say never. 

Fournier, Birch, Randle, Mane, and Ennis all expire at the end of the season, so I would expect that they are shopping Fournier, Birch, and Ennis right now. I would expect that Birch, Ennis, Clark, and Bacon are all available to "make the numbers work" in any other trades we might be exploring, as well. With our injuries, we need Randle right now, unless we get another (better) PG in a trade; and I don't see Mane going anywhere. He's a young, developmental guy that I think sticks either as a 2-way again next year, or an end of the bench slot. It seems like he had a lot of growth playing in Lakeland, and may have a future with the parent club. 

 

 

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46 minutes ago, jmmagicfan said:

Spotrac is showing Clark as guaranteed for next year, but Bacon as non-guaranteed. A decision on Bacon has to happen before August, or he becomes guaranteed automatically. 

 https://www.spotrac.com/nba/orlando-magic/cap/2021/.

They are usually pretty accurate, though they do sometimes take a few days to update after a trade or other change. The disabled player exception we received for Fultz has expired (unused, obviously), and the one for Isaac expires 4/17/21. We could possibly waive Clark, and use a portion of that exception to add a non-minimum salary player if someone gets bought out, and not signed elsewhere. Since we are more than half-way through the season, even if we sign someone to the full $3.6M exception, it still wouldn't put us in the tax-payer category, as we'd pay less than half a year's salary. Not sure why we would, or why someone might come here for that, but never say never. 

Fournier, Birch, Randle, Mane, and Ennis all expire at the end of the season, so I would expect that they are shopping Fournier, Birch, and Ennis right now. I would expect that Birch, Ennis, Clark, and Bacon are all available to "make the numbers work" in any other trades we might be exploring, as well. With our injuries, we need Randle right now, unless we get another (better) PG in a trade; and I don't see Mane going anywhere. He's a young, developmental guy that I think sticks either as a 2-way again next year, or an end of the bench slot. It seems like he had a lot of growth playing in Lakeland, and may have a future with the parent club. 

 

 

Yea some places have Gary Clark as a guaranteed second year but there was definitely reporting that it was a team option.

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3 hours ago, Soul Bro said:

The irony with the whole Vooch discussion is that the majority of this board would have traded Vooch for just one first rounder a couple of years ago. Huge credit to the big guy for lifting his game.

Depends on the first round pick ;) 

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How are there still 9 days until the deadline?!

My own trade deadline hopes:

We get at least 1 FRP for Evan Fournier

We get something of positive value for Birch

We manage to include Gary Clark in a trade as filler which opens up a roster spot

We might make more moves than that but if we don't i'd still consider it to be a win if we accomplish those 3 things. 

 

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4 hours ago, CTMagicUK said:

How are there still 9 days until the deadline?!

My own trade deadline hopes:

We get at least 1 FRP for Evan Fournier

We get something of positive value for Birch

We manage to include Gary Clark in a trade as filler which opens up a roster spot

We might make more moves than that but if we don't i'd still consider it to be a win if we accomplish those 3 things. 

 

I think we trade Fournier and Clark for Jeff Green.  

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