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2020-2021 General Game Thread

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4 hours ago, CTMagicUK said:

I'm feeling so conflicted about backup C. I love the energy and hustle of Birch and he's the kind of guy I could see sticking around for a long time for us if we wanted but honestly think we might be better off trading him, getting some value for him while he's playing well, and giving Mo some actual minutes. Either way I think we need to trade one of the two. It's not doing anyone any favours Bamba picking up DNP-CD every night. 

What about finally trading Vuc, keep them both as cheap C's options, and finally start to be designed like an actual NBA team? :)

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6 minutes ago, Luke_FfS said:

What about finally trading Vuc, keep them both as cheap C's options, and finally start to be designed like an actual NBA team? :)

Yea I forgot actual NBA teams don't have All Star level Centers who shoot 40+% from 3. 

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7 hours ago, Jay Magic said:

Honestly we really need to finish with a top 2 pick in this draft. Then we are right on track for success 

Need to get rid of Weham first. 

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30 minutes ago, CTMagicUK said:

Yea I forgot actual NBA teams don't have All Star level Centers who shoot 40+% from 3. 

But maybe you forgot about the other side of the field... you know,  defense, that little thing that make average team contenders, and great teams NBA champions.
Vuc hasn't made nothing of that for us in almost a decade.

Tell me the last team that win the ring and had a skilled offensive center, but a defensive liability, as a starter and 35+ minutes player. I mean, Dwight... I repeat... Dwight was quite important in last season playoffs because McGee was becoming unplayable a lot of times. Marc Gasol was the previous one.. an all around that anchor the defense. GS almost never cared about centers... Cleveland? SA? Miami? Denver as a much better version than Vuc in their team, and they've been spectacular and competive in the last few season... but they cannot solve their defensive problems anyway.

None of them would have won the title with Vuch in the lineup... I can't care less about All-Star presences, that's as empty as a definition of a player could be.

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1 hour ago, Luke_FfS said:

But maybe you forgot about the other side of the field... you know,  defense, that little thing that make average team contenders, and great teams NBA champions.
Vuc hasn't made nothing of that for us in almost a decade.

Tell me the last team that win the ring and had a skilled offensive center, but a defensive liability, as a starter and 35+ minutes player. I mean, Dwight... I repeat... Dwight was quite important in last season playoffs because McGee was becoming unplayable a lot of times. Marc Gasol was the previous one.. an all around that anchor the defense. GS almost never cared about centers... Cleveland? SA? Miami? Denver as a much better version than Vuc in their team, and they've been spectacular and competive in the last few season... but they cannot solve their defensive problems anyway.

None of them would have won the title with Vuch in the lineup... I can't care less about All-Star presences, that's as empty as a definition of a player could be.

But Vuc has been the best player on a team that's been a top 10 (ish) defense the past two years. He's also lead the team in a bunch of defensive advanced stats if those are your thing.  Is he a good defensive player for his position? No not really but he's competent, he tries, he rebounds, he contests, he has decent hands to swipe balls away and get in passing lanes. More importantly wether you think Vuc is a negative on defense or not he is easily a top 5 center on offense and without him I'm pretty convinced we would have the single worst offense in the NBA right now. 

Great players win championships. All those championship teams you listed won because they had transcendent talents not because they had centers that fit into your neat little box of what you think a center should be.

 

EDIT: And you don't think this version of Vuc could win a title with any of those championship teams? GS arent winning the title with Vuc at C? Curry, Klay, KD, Draymond, Vuc isn't winning a title? Come on now. So if we offered Vuc for Zaza Paculia straight up that year the Warriors would have lost the title? Really?

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1 hour ago, All Eyes On Me said:

There’s a few advanced stats out there that point to Vucevic being the second best all around player in the league only behind Jokic so far this year

Statistics lie. That’s obvious. Vuch gets handled by all the best centers in the league. He is great at one thing. Boosting his numbers against bad centers. And CT, saying we would be the worst offense in the nba without him. We are 28th offensively with him. So what exactly is he adding to our offense?

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10 hours ago, Jay Magic said:

Honestly we really need to finish with a top 2 pick in this draft. Then we are right on track for success 

This means you trust this management to make the right pick. Geezus! They have picked in the last four years:

Isaac: high potential but can’t stay healthy and playe less than half the games since drafted. 

Bamba: injured even more and shows less potential. 

Okeke: injured the whole dam time and hasn’t showed much potential at all. 

Anthony: another guy coming of a bad injury, some potential but playing out of position and stunting his growth. 

Tell me where is the evidence, that you can show how this management is able to make a first round pick worth changing the franchise in a positive way. 

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2 hours ago, CTMagicUK said:

EDIT: And you don't think this version of Vuc could win a title with any of those championship teams? GS arent winning the title with Vuc at C? Curry, Klay, KD, Draymond, Vuc isn't winning a title? Come on now. So if we offered Vuc for Zaza Paculia straight up that year the Warriors would have lost the title? Really?

Honestly not, but I know it's just my opinion and can't be confirmed. As yours actually. :)
But it's actually quite a fact the thing that none of the recent champions, were champions with a player with the characteristic of Vuch at center. That's why I was talking about playing the style that works in the actual NBA. It's not the time of Hakeem, Pat, Shaq, anymore.
Apart from that, you can't change Vuc fo Zaza straight up, in the sense that if you've Vuch, you also have his salary. and you've to renounce to something else.

I apologize to have gone a little off topic, but the most important point for me is still:

A) if management think, like you, that Vuc could be a good piece in a contender/championship team, do everything you could to surround him with another all-star and the right kind of players to complement him. What are they waiting for? He's not getting any younger.

B) if management think, like me, that he's not that kind of player, just sell him as high as possible and choose another path.

I could live with solution A, even if I don't agree with that. But staying in the middle, not taking any decision, and condemn us to mediocrity... that's something I couldn't accept at all. STOP the evaluating process please.

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2 hours ago, fan for too long 2 said:

Statistics lie. That’s obvious. Vuch gets handled by all the best centers in the league. He is great at one thing. Boosting his numbers against bad centers. And CT, saying we would be the worst offense in the nba without him. We are 28th offensively with him. So what exactly is he adding to our offense?

He's adding 23.6 points 3.6 assists and high volume, high efficiency 3 point shooting.

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2 hours ago, Luke_FfS said:

Honestly not, but I know it's just my opinion and can't be confirmed. As yours actually. :)
But it's actually quite a fact the thing that none of the recent champions, were champions with a player with the characteristic of Vuch at center. That's why I was talking about playing the style that works in the actual NBA. It's not the time of Hakeem, Pat, Shaq, anymore.
Apart from that, you can't change Vuc fo Zaza straight up, in the sense that if you've Vuch, you also have his salary. and you've to renounce to something else.

I apologize to have gone a little off topic, but the most important point for me is still:

A) if management think, like you, that Vuc could be a good piece in a contender/championship team, do everything you could to surround him with another all-star and the right kind of players to complement him. What are they waiting for? He's not getting any younger.

B) if management think, like me, that he's not that kind of player, just sell him as high as possible and choose another path.

I could live with solution A, even if I don't agree with that. But staying in the middle, not taking any decision, and condemn us to mediocrity... that's something I couldn't accept at all. STOP the evaluating process please.

I hate the middle of the road approach we are taking as a potential 7/8th seed and would prefer if management went one way or another. Even if it didn’t work out at least show some aggression. 

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On the Vooch discussions, it’s okay to want to trade him, it’s okay to say that we’re not good enough even with him, it’s even okay to desire more from him. What’s not okay for us as Magic fans is to deny that he’s been anything less than very good if not great this year, we just don’t have enough help around him. He is literally our only consistent player. Again. And he’s been nothing but grateful to the city, the organization and  been a great professional and face of the franchise for the past decade. Let’s not make him something he’s not.

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