2020-2021 Official Magic Season Thread

[CTMagicUK 1,480]

7 hours ago, Jay Magic said:

Cliff loool

This is the most disappointing thing I've read about the Magic since... Well about a month ago actually when Fultz got injured. 

I don't get what we're doing here? If I was Jeff Weltman and I read this I would literally trade Khem Birch for a bag of chips just to prove a point. 

The sad thing is I actually like Khem. Under normal circumstances I'd love to keep him into the future as a hustle guy in that 13th-15th man spot. But the development of Bamba is considerably more important than his minutes. 

If we're being honest here you can find other undersized 5s who set screens, hustle and are good team mates. If you could find Mo Bambas anywhere then why did we draft one #6 overall? 

 

[CTMagicUK 1,480]

Seriously, I'm hoping the organisation is trying to pump Birch's value for a trade and that's why we want to keep playing him. That's literally the only way I'd be happy with Bamba getting no minutes for the next couple of weeks is if we somehow got like a late 1st or a couple of 2nd rounders for Birch. 

[Luke_FfS 248]

3 hours ago, CTMagicUK said:

I don't get what we're doing here? If I was Jeff Weltman and I read this I would literally trade Khem Birch for a bag of chips just to prove a point.

Cliff mandate is to win as much as possible, like in every past season. I don't blame him for playing Birch, actually there's a fair argument that he's the best solution right now, given the mandate. The problem is not Cliff, the problem is who hired him and who act in the market like a team that has to go to the playoffs at all costs, even as a losing 8th seed.

The solution isn't trade Birch either, but, as I've repeated a million times, finally sell high on Vuch and start with a new path. Both Bamba and Birch will have minutes after that trade. Until they keep Nik, they clearly want to compete and Birch is the backup C. He has eraned it.

[CTMagicUK 1,480]

22 minutes ago, Luke_FfS said:

Cliff mandate is to win as much as possible, like in every past season. I don't blame him for playing Birch, actually there's a fair argument that he's the best solution right now, given the mandate. The problem is not Cliff, the problem is who hired him and who act in the market like a team that has to go to the playoffs at all costs, even as a losing 8th seed.

The solution isn't trade Birch either, but, as I've repeated a million times, finally sell high on Vuch and start with a new path. Both Bamba and Birch will have minutes after that trade. Until they keep Nik, they clearly want to compete and Birch is the backup C. He has eraned it.

My problem is I want Mo Bamba to play the backup center minutes so Im going to have to vehemently disagree with the idea that the solution isn't 'trade Khem Birch'.

[The Neighborhood Bully 266]

Quote

Teams can help young players improve in two primary ways. One, by working with the player on the practice court and in the film room, where coaches and veterans can help guide their training. Teams like the Spurs and Raptors have excelled in that area for many years, but those two franchises and others also utilize the second method to help young players: playing time, whether it’s in the G League or in the NBA. This is the area in which Orlando isn’t nurturing Bamba’s development.

Bamba finds himself in the Big Red Dog house of Magic head coach Steve Clifford, appearing in only nine games while receiving the far majority of his minutes in garbage time. In a recent interview with The Athletic, Clifford said Bamba is riding the bench because center is the team’s “best position by far,” with Nikola Vucevic and Khem Birch routinely playing ahead of Bamba. Clifford prioritizes playing veterans, not an inexperienced big who hasn’t impacted winning. But in Clifford’s own words, Birch is one of their “best five or six players right now.” Birch is a rock-solid center who could be in a regular-season rotation for many teams. But if he’s one of your top players, your team is gonna lose a lot. Indeed, the Magic are 9-15 with the second-worst net rating in the league. Which begs the question of why Birch is playing ahead of a player the Magic drafted sixth in 2018.

This is a sign of nasty dysfunction. If Bamba is gonna end up a bust, let’s see it on the court. Bamba is perceived as a low-effort player, but when he’s been provided opportunities this season, I’ve seen him consistently hustle. The past two seasons, he often looked clunky and underdeveloped. But this season, he’s looked more fluid than ever on both ends of the court.

On Saturday, Bamba had his best game against the Bulls. Clifford’s primary rotation trailed by 31 points entering the fourth quarter. Then Bamba played the entire final frame. His size was a deterrent around the rim on multiple Zach LaVine drives and on three other blocks. He hustled for rebounds and on transition chances. He scored 14 points by finishing lobs, attacking a closeout, and hitting jumpers. Bamba looked like a player who could help the Magic, or another team, win more games.

https://www.theringer.com/nba/2021/2/8/22271901/power-rankings-lakers-clippers-sixers-jazz

[Soul Bro 1,419]

I want to play Bamba, and I believe a trade will be needed to make that happen, but I understand Cliff’s mentality. He doesn’t want young guys to be gifted minutes, he wants them to earn those minutes.

More than any other highly drafted player I can remember for the Magic, Mo has been inconsistent in his early years with the Magic. Cliff has played young guys like Cole, Fultz, Isaac and Okeke. Maybe injuries have allowed for such, but I wouldn’t be surprised if we end up hearing there was more going on with Mo behind the scenes in practice, meetings, and beyond that called into question his commitment.

The good news is something has to be done in O-Town because our record and roster are a hot mess right now.

[CTMagicUK 1,480]

18 minutes ago, Soul Bro said:

I want to play Bamba, and I believe a trade will be needed to make that happen, but I understand Cliff’s mentality. He doesn’t want young guys to be gifted minutes, he wants them to earn those minutes.

More than any other highly drafted player I can remember for the Magic, Mo has been inconsistent in his early years with the Magic. Cliff has played young guys like Cole, Fultz, Isaac and Okeke. Maybe injuries have allowed for such, but I wouldn’t be surprised if we end hearing there was more going on with Mo behind the scenes in practice, meetings, and beyond that called into question his commitment.

The good news is something has to be done in O-Town because our record and roster are a hot mess right now.

I completely understand the idea that young guys should earn minutes. But surely if you're not in the rotation the way you do that is play well in garbage time? Mo did that and now Cliff says "yea still no minutes for you".

I guess maybe Cliff is trying to light a fire under Mo by basically saying "I want you to do that every garbage time and when you do finally get a chance you better grab it with both hands"? That might work to be fair. 

And you're right maybe there is more going on behind the scenes that we don't know about which would change how we feel as fans. But we'll never know these things, in most cases, until after the fact so we can only comment on what we do know. 

I just think so many Magic fans wouldn't care if Mo didn't play if we were winning games but we're losing with Mo on the bench so we might as well at least see if he can help us win. 

[CTMagicUK 1,480]

Gary Clark is 81 out of 88 SF's (not sure why he's listed at SF) listed in ESPN's RPM stat. 

Out of every player who's played more than 250 mins he's 272 out of 290 in 538s RAPTOR. (Last among Magic players)

And he's last in PER out of 188 qualifying players according to basketball reference. 

I was a big fan of bringing him back after the way he played in the bubble but if he's still here next season I'll be astonished. 

[All Eyes On Me 1,206]

1 hour ago, CTMagicUK said:

Gary Clark is 81 out of 88 SF's (not sure why he's listed at SF) listed in ESPN's RPM stat. 

Out of every player who's played more than 250 mins he's 272 out of 290 in 538s RAPTOR. (Last among Magic players)

And he's last in PER out of 188 qualifying players according to basketball reference. 

I was a big fan of bringing him back after the way he played in the bubble but if he's still here next season I'll be astonished. 

Yeah, and rumor has it Aminu is back tonight which should mean Clark is out of the rotation. I feel for the guy, but this was his chance to show he could crack an NBA rotation and he failed. I’ll one up your comment and say I’ll be astonished if he’s in the NBA next year 

[All Eyes On Me 1,206]

2 hours ago, CTMagicUK said:I just think so many Magic fans wouldn't care if Mo didn't play if we were winning games but we're losing with Mo on the bench so we might as well at least see if he can help us win. 

Yep, this is the big disconnect right now. Management and coaching are pretending like if we just play better we can compete, when the talent disparity between us and almost every other team is just downright massive. A 28 year old hustle Center over a 22 year old prospect Center makes perfect sense on a contender it the 28 year old is helping win games, but here and now in our situation it makes zero sense. One of Vucevic, Birch, Bamba will be traded by the deadline, but if I was gambling on it I’d say it’s Mo.

[harley 61]

If these clowns *****ing trade Mo and keep Vooch/Birch then there would be riots. I’d find another team that’s for sure. as mentioned above that last Clifford statement about “no minutes” after what Mo just produced has to be the most deflating and depressing things I have ever heard from this organisation. And after how this season has gone this is the last thing we needed to hear smh. 
I can’t come back to Clifford from here, I want him gone more than anything. 

[OnlyFranz 289]

3 hours ago, harley said:

If these clowns *****ing trade Mo and keep Vooch/Birch then there would be riots. I’d find another team that’s for sure. as mentioned above that last Clifford statement about “no minutes” after what Mo just produced has to be the most deflating and depressing things I have ever heard from this organisation. And after how this season has gone this is the last thing we needed to hear smh. 
I can’t come back to Clifford from here, I want him gone more than anything. 

Agreed! Clifford needs to go for even thinking this way and Weltham needs to go for even allowing this to happen with the current state this team is in. In no world should your draft pick only get garbage time minutes when we are getting blown out and losing games anyways. This goes back to the incompetence/lack of a winning culture of this whole organization.