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2020 Official Off-Season Thread

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We could agree that Fultz is a possible x-factor (and that's already a bad start, a contender need more than that and a often injured Isaac to have a solid base) and needs to be maxed out.
But that's not going to happen with this FO, with old style Clifford (love him, but still..), and with other high usage veterans that require the ball a lot, Ross included (he seemed the ONLY option with the bench last season) How many times the ball was in Fourner hands in the final minutes of close games, for example?

We can beat that horse until the death, but the problem is always the same: the direction of the franchise/management is not one that gives a lot of hopes, at least as I see it...

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A fast start can really help this team. They need confidence. Health,development,aggressive Fultz and some of our players starting the year hot. Let's face it, two of the last 3 years the whole team was ice cold. And the one hot year it only lasted 15 games.Then I'll be excited.

If we squeak into an eighth seed and Fultz and Bamba still look like rookies it will be depressing. Always the chance Chuma, Cole or maybe even Bacon explodes. That would be exciting. 

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6 hours ago, CTMagicUK said:

Here's the thing with the whole "running it back" debate for me. I think it hinges entirely on whether you believe Markelle Fultz can be a star. 

Let's just say you really believe Markelle Fultz is going to be a star and you were trying to build an ideal roster around him. You're likely to want:

A SG whos a very good shooter and can also run some pick and roll and act as a secondary ball handler. (Fournier)

A C who is a consistent pick and pop threat. (Vuc and also maybe Bamba?)

A high volume scoring option (Also Vuc although I think in an ideal world down the line you'd want this to be a wing) 

A second PG who can play either on or off ball and hit open jumpers. (Cole we hope, previously DJ)

Guys who can shoot (Ross, Clark, hopefully Okeke)

Guys who can guard smaller guards on ball and let Fultz get in the passing lanes and be disruptive off ball (Cole Anthony hopefully and MCW)

And you obviously want all of that without compromising your identity as a long disruptive defensive team which has made you a top 10 defense and is the reason for your improvements pre Fultz. 

And when you list it all out like that... This roster isnt that bad for getting the best out of Fultz as constructed. 

Yes, obviously in an ideal world you'd want some really high volume, high efficiency 3 point shooting 6'6+ guys on the wing instead of James Ennis, Aminu and Dwayne Bacon and maybe AG (although AG is a different case in my opinion because he offers a lot inspite of average shooting) but high volume, high efficiency guys that are 6'6+ don't really grow on trees (bracing myself for someone to bring up Duncan Robinson) and they often command a lot of money in free agency (see Joe Harris and Davis Bertans new contracts). And the thing about Ennis and AG (Bacon is an interesting one actually because he's had a 40+% 3 point season so if he gets back to that he actually belongs in the TRoss, Clark group) is even though they're not great shooters they're willing shooters and oftentimes that's enough to provide gravity and create some space (see Robert Covington for the most extreme example of this I can think of).

Now I understand wanting to see change, I also would like to trade Fournier since if we don't we either lose him for nothing with no cap space to replace him or he re-signs which limits us for 3+ more years. But it has to be considered that there aren't many better SG's suited to playing with Fultz than Fournier. The ones that are probably aren't available. You could hope for addition by subtraction but you'd still be looking for a guard who can shoot and be a secondary ball handler there I think.

Obviously if you don't think Fultz can be a star I can completey understand wanting to make a bunch of moves because in your mind this team has no higher ceiling than its current construction. I've got a feeling though that Weltman does think Fultz will take a leap.

And sure it's pretty uninspiring signing the same guys who's limitations you already know Vs new guys who you haven't seen as much and are shiny and new but I do think all our free agent signings were shrewd and smart moves with low risk.

I'm also going to say that it might end up looking bad that we let Iwundu go because Dallas is going to be a really great place for him to develop. With Doncic doing all the creating the game's going to be really simplified for him. The important thing to remember with that is if that does happen it probably wouldn't have happened here.

 

Excellent post, well thought out and expressed.  I would have added a plus one if I hadn’t already used up all of mine.  I do have the following questions/comments:
 

1.  Why did you put Clark in the “guys who can shoot” category?   He was a mediocre shooter last year.  
 

2.  One of the knocks on Vuch is that he’s relatively slow (because of his size, not an effort thing) and that for him to be effective, the offense has to run through him.  How does that help Fultz?   I would think it would hinder him.  
 

3. I didn’t understand the Duncan Robinson comment above.  Did he actually come from a tree?

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5 hours ago, CTMagicUK said:

Here's the thing with the whole "running it back" debate for me. I think it hinges entirely on whether you believe Markelle Fultz can be a star. 

Let's just say you really believe Markelle Fultz is going to be a star and you were trying to build an ideal roster around him. You're likely to want:

A SG whos a very good shooter and can also run some pick and roll and act as a secondary ball handler. (Fournier)

A C who is a consistent pick and pop threat. (Vuc and also maybe Bamba?)

A high volume scoring option (Also Vuc although I think in an ideal world down the line you'd want this to be a wing) 

A second PG who can play either on or off ball and hit open jumpers. (Cole we hope, previously DJ)

Guys who can shoot (Ross, Clark, hopefully Okeke)

Guys who can guard smaller guards on ball and let Fultz get in the passing lanes and be disruptive off ball (Cole Anthony hopefully and MCW)

And you obviously want all of that without compromising your identity as a long disruptive defensive team which has made you a top 10 defense and is the reason for your improvements pre Fultz. 

And when you list it all out like that... This roster isnt that bad for getting the best out of Fultz as constructed. 

 

Even if all that ends up being true, unless Fultz is the best player in the league (he isn’t) it still isn’t a team that can actually compete for a championship. 

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8 hours ago, fan for too long 2 said:

Good for Wes. His energy will be missed. Hope he gets the burn he should of gotten here. 

He doesn’t shoot well enough to get a lot of burn on a team like Dallas. 

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1 hour ago, Luke_FfS said:

We can beat that horse until the death, but the problem is always the same: the direction of the franchise/management is not one that gives a lot of hopes, at least as I see it...

We are not going to beat any animals to death on this forum.  It would be terrible PR for the Magic, and the moderators would never allow it. 

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1 minute ago, Jason Funderburker said:

Even if all that ends up being true, unless Fultz is the best player in the league (he isn’t) it still isn’t a team that can actually compete for a championship. 

What we’re doing now has nothing to do with competing for a championship in the short term.

 

The biggest moves we have to make right now are working on the extensions for Fultz and Isaac. If we’re planning on bringing either or both of them back, I feel those extensions need to be taken care of before the season starts, but I’m extremely curious what the length and numbers will look like.

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2 minutes ago, All Eyes On Me said:

What we’re doing now has nothing to do with competing for a championship in the short term.

 

The biggest moves we have to make right now are working on the extensions for Fultz and Isaac. If we’re planning on bringing either or both of them back, I feel those extensions need to be taken care of before the season starts, but I’m extremely curious what the length and numbers will look like.

And the problem is it’s very hard to predict anything with regards to Isaac at this point.  Will he even come back at all?  If he does, will he be the same kind of player and continue to develop?   Will he get injured again?

Too many unknowns. 

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3 minutes ago, JJZFL said:

And the problem is it’s very hard to predict anything with regards to Isaac at this point.  Will he even come back at all?  If he does, will he be the same kind of player and continue to develop?   Will he get injured again?

Too many unknowns. 

Right. I’d try to sign him to something similar to what Steph got after his rookie deal. 4 for 40, but that’s still super risky for both sides

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28 minutes ago, hootie249 said:

A fast start can really help this team. They need confidence. Health,development,aggressive Fultz and some of our players starting the year hot. Let's face it, two of the last 3 years the whole team was ice cold. And the one hot year it only lasted 15 games.Then I'll be excited.

If we squeak into an eighth seed and Fultz and Bamba still look like rookies it will be depressing. Always the chance Chuma, Cole or maybe even Bacon explodes. That would be exciting. 

I do want to see what okeke can do. Gordon could do more if we feature him in the offense more. 

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2 hours ago, JJZFL said:

Excellent post, well thought out and expressed.  I would have added a plus one if I hadn’t already used up all of mine.  I do have the following questions/comments:
 

1.  Why did you put Clark in the “guys who can shoot” category?   He was a mediocre shooter last year.  
 

2.  One of the knocks on Vuch is that he’s relatively slow (because of his size, not an effort thing) and that for him to be effective, the offense has to run through him.  How does that help Fultz?   I would think it would hinder him.  
 

3. I didn’t understand the Duncan Robinson comment above.  Did he actually come from a tree?

1) Clark can shoot, he needs more minutes to stay in rhythm. You could see it in the playoffs when we were forced to stay with him. 

2) Vuc helps fultz in the halfcourt with pick and pop. He has great hands and finishes on pick roll. Plus, he can hit 3s for spacing.

3) He is saying that shooters with good size are hard to come by... 

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22 minutes ago, All Eyes On Me said:

Right. I’d try to sign him to something similar to what Steph got after his rookie deal. 4 for 40, but that’s still super risky for both sides

Payscale has changed since steph had that contract. It maybe around 17-18 mil in today's money. Per year 

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