Jump to content
Fultz4thewin

2019-2020 Official Regular Season Thread

Recommended Posts

10 hours ago, Bebop Meat Mop said:

 

  

Increased training can add it's own wear and tear, and that training is beginning at much younger ages as well.

With tennis I think it may have more to do with players being able to maintain their quickness and flexibility better as they get older (because of advances in training), along with it being a lower impact sport in general.  It's not that comparable athletically.  Also there was a pretty flukey crop of all-time great players that just happened to show up around the same time with Federer, Nadal, Serena, and Djokovic a little later.  Nobody since has had the pure talent to really measure up.  

Actually, I think tennis is probably the best athletic comparison of any other sport from the standpoint of distances run, start/stop and change of direction, emphasis on legs and shoulders. The biggest difference from the athletic standpoint is undoubtedly the amount of contact (none in tennis, obviously). Good point about the fluke crop of all-time great players though. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Fultz4thewin said:

Also our 4th quarter defensive rating is 88.8. obviously it's early and almost assuredly going to jump up significantly but just for the sake of comparisons, the lowest fourth quarter defensive rating I can find with the data available since the 96-97 season is the 00-01 Knicks. They were at 91.1. most years no team has a fourth quarter defensive rating below 100. The best recent number I can find is the 10-11 bulls. They were at 96.2. 

Our 08-09 team was at 103.8

Last year's team post all star was 104.6

There best number over the past 3 seasons was the 17-18 raptors at 101.7

 

Crazy.

The Memphis game has some impact on that but even if I sort it just vs Eastern conference teams we're still at 96. And that number is heavily impacted by the Milwaukee game and doesn't include great defensive games against Dallas or OKC where we had sub 90 defensive ratings. 

Yeah, pretty crazy. I don't even think we are playing as good as we could defensively. Isaac has been balling out, but I feel like most of the other guys have more to give on that end and even Isaac could get better on some things. At the same time, a lot of this is likely statistical noise- there is always the chance that the numbers look good partially because teams are just not hitting shots rather than something we are doing.

 

3 hours ago, jmmagicfan said:

1. I think that is by design - mid range and long 2's are the least efficient shots on average, so if you are going to give up/force a shot, that is the preferred shot to give up.

2. Again, I think this is also by design - Clifford is much more focused on getting back/defense; and not really big on offensive rebounding.

3. Hope this continues - not sure why, but wonder if it is partly due to guys who aren't shooting well from outside attacking the paint more?

4. Isaac having a block party and defensive team focus? Hard to block because of our length? Taking care of the ball is another Clifford focus item.

5. Encouraging, let's hope it continues improving. I really think TRoss was having more of an issue with health than any of us realized.

Yes, by design, but it looks like the design is working. (at least so far). 

 

All of this is more to show trends, more than anything else. I don't think you can really seriously look at the numbers until about 20 games have been played- giving a good sample size.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm not on the trade Gordon train at all, but I just need to say that he struggles so badly when going Iso against someone. If it's not giving away a charge, it's dribbling into trouble or it's taking a ridiculously hard step back jumper.

I think we need to accept that he's never going to be good at beating his man one on one and that's fine. He's still a really good player, he's great on cuts, he's pretty good taking the open 3, he's great getting hustle points off rebounds, he's pretty good in transition, good passer for the most part. All that while being a really good athletic defender. So I'm still high on him, I just think he has some limitations on offense that he doesn't look like he'll overcome, and the sooner he does less of it and more of just what he's good at, the better we'll be as a team overall. 

Having said all that, Gordon's issues pail in comparison to what Vuc and Fournier are doing in limiting the potential of our athletic, built to run young core.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, The Boss said:

I'm not on the trade Gordon train at all, but I just need to say that he struggles so badly when going Iso against someone. If it's not giving away a charge, it's dribbling into trouble or it's taking a ridiculously hard step back jumper.

I think we need to accept that he's never going to be good at beating his man one on one and that's fine. He's still a really good player, he's great on cuts, he's pretty good taking the open 3, he's great getting hustle points off rebounds, he's pretty good in transition, good passer for the most part. All that while being a really good athletic defender. So I'm still high on him, I just think he has some limitations on offense that he doesn't look like he'll overcome, and the sooner he does less of it and more of just what he's good at, the better we'll be as a team overall. 

Having said all that, Gordon's issues pail in comparison to what Vuc and Fournier are doing in limiting the potential of our athletic, built to run young core.

Those aren't ISOs. Those are drives or transition buckets. I'm not sure Gordon has an isolation possession this year. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 minutes ago, Fultz4thewin said:

Those aren't ISOs. Those are drives or transition buckets. I'm not sure Gordon has an isolation possession this year. 

Fair call, I was struggling to describe the kinds of plays so called them ISOs. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
28 minutes ago, Fultz4thewin said:

Those aren't ISOs. Those are drives or transition buckets. I'm not sure Gordon has an isolation possession this year. 

I love Gordon but imaging a clear out for Gordon is hilarious. I can imagine 100 different things happening half of them being terrible while the other half results in "wow he made it".

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
23 minutes ago, The Boss said:

Fair call, I was struggling to describe the kinds of plays so called them ISOs. 

(Please don't take this as condescending because I don't know another way to describe it)

 

The way you know if a play is an isolation is if the rest of the team isolates the player with the ball. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
43 minutes ago, Fultz4thewin said:

Those aren't ISOs. Those are drives or transition buckets. I'm not sure Gordon has an isolation possession this year. 

I figured he was talking more about the attempts to take his man one-on-one, as opposed to true "clear-out ISO" plays - since we don't really run many (any?) true ISO plays. I don't see any of our guys really being true ISO-able players; hence the motion offense. Our problems seem to come when one (or two) players dominate the ball and it stops moving. Gordon, Ross, and the Fournier/Vucevic duo are all guilty of this at times. 

  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Nothing I hate more that when the pick/roll or pick/pop becomes patty-cake between the man-crushes. You go, no you go, no you go; oops, now we're down to five seconds, and have to rush a bad shot.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
55 minutes ago, jmmagicfan said:

I figured he was talking more about the attempts to take his man one-on-one, as opposed to true "clear-out ISO" plays - since we don't really run many (any?) true ISO plays. I don't see any of our guys really being true ISO-able players; hence the motion offense. Our problems seem to come when one (or two) players dominate the ball and it stops moving. Gordon, Ross, and the Fournier/Vucevic duo are all guilty of this at times. 

The funny thing is DJ is the guy with the most ISOs. Those occur when a center switches onto him. 

 

But yeah. Gordon has a problem getting offensive fouls. I don't know if it's a reputation thing. 

Anecdotal evidence says guys who initiate contract with finesse pretty layups and floaters get called for the offensive foul approximately 99% of the time while guys who initiate considerably more contact and dunk almost never get called for offensive fouls so maybe he should just dunk. 

  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So what are we thinking about the Derozan speculation? There is a lot of reads out there saying it would be dumb including Spurs fans as they are turning on him. Is he better than Fournier... not real sure besides the volume scoring he has. A lot of talk around being a ball hog and taking risky shots so not much difference with Fournier really. Have not watched him on the Spurs but surely he can defend better than Fournier. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×