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From Robbins story today

"Magic officials still think highly of Isaac and are strongly disinclined to give him up"

"The magic have not shown any signs they are willing to trade Gordon, either, sources said... The magic are intent on pairing Gordon with Isaac in the lineup"

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At least Isaac and Bamba are showing flashes of competence. Good for us if we want to go with the youth movement

I'm equally (not) excited about building around Vuc + vets, or youth movement.

I just want our management to do something to help either scenario

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42 minutes ago, Mauro Pedrosa said:

At least Isaac and Bamba are showing flashes of competence. Good for us if we want to go with the youth movement

I'm equally (not) excited about building around Vuc + vets, or youth movement.

I just want our management to do something to help either scenario

Completely agree. I think Vuc can stay if he is willing to not take a max deal.

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I really don't want to keep Vuc past this season. I think he is holding back the whole team with the game plan built around him. We need to move into a fast paced offense and beat teams with all the athleticism we have been drafting.

Like what I think ?4thewin said about how once we get a better PG and SG the offense will rely less and less on Vuc and as we rely less his value to the team goes down, it's like a sliding scale working the opposite to the rest of the team.

Vuc has played great this season no doubt, but he's done it with horrible play from our back court and a whole offense built around him, all while in a contract year.

I just think moving to a play style that suits the roster (once we get a good PG) will be enough to offset the loss of Vuc. If Bamba isn't ready then sign someone like Jordan for 1 year or start Birch if you think he's good enough until Bamba is ready.

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2 hours ago, Mauro Pedrosa said:

I'd like to see us trade for a decent PG but also get a dominant wing player, even if we have to move one of the young guys. Someone like Jimmy Butler or something

Someone like Jimmy Butler sure, but not Jimmy Butler. I’m a fan of his game but he’s forced his way out of every team he’s ever played for and has come close to doing it with Philly, Disney wouldn’t be the right spot for him. 

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Have you all hit your heads recently? After years of unanimous agreement that Vooch needs to go, you’re now comfortable rebuilding around him? 

Last few years with no viable replacement on the roster: “TRADE HIM, GUY SUCKS. ENOUGH IS ENOUGH.”

This year after just drafting his obvious, high-ceiling replacement: “Well let’s not get too hasty here... I mean the guy has been playing pretty well.”

 

Does it not alarm some of you that even in Vooch’s “good” year, we’re still 20-28 in the weakest Eastern Conference in recent memory? What part of his Renaissance has translated to anything meaningful results-wise? 

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2 hours ago, J-Mac said:

It's his contract year! Props to him I didn't expect him to play in a all-star level, but if we resign him then what? Will he continue this level of play and if he doesn't now what? We already saw how hard it was to trade him before, his value is at its highest right now. Kinda reminds me of that hedo situation

 

     Exactly, i'm thinking this might be his best year and that's it. Look Vuch is a great center, if he was on a team with a great wing scorer or shooter he would fit.

Like most centers in this day and age, the offense should not run through him in the 4th quarter. How do we get that player when we resign him?

If we resign Vuch and Ross, or even one of them i feel locked in. Do we get a decent point guard with 12-17 million dollars this summer? I have seen the list, we will get somebody. Chances are we are stuck in mediocrity, big time. It would't be so bad if this was 4 years ago but we all predicted this years ago!

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48 minutes ago, ML6 said:

Have you all hit your heads recently? After years of unanimous agreement that Vooch needs to go, you’re now comfortable rebuilding around him? 

Last few years with no viable replacement on the roster: “TRADE HIM, GUY SUCKS. ENOUGH IS ENOUGH.”

This year after just drafting his obvious, high-ceiling replacement: “Well let’s not get too hasty here... I mean the guy has been playing pretty well.”

 

Does it not alarm some of you that even in Vooch’s “good” year, we’re still 20-28 in the weakest Eastern Conference in recent memory? What part of his Renaissance has translated to anything meaningful results-wise? 

Yeah I don’t get it. Everyone  is afraid to make the next step. 

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Vucevic gets his value from facilitating from the elbow. We dump the ball to him there. It draws centers out. Vucevic hits cutters or Gordon posting. If that's not there he runs a dribble handoff to the wing (or occasionally takes his man off the dribble). Then that evolves into a screen and roll with vucevic again. Vucevic almost always pops. If the big stays with him the ball handler drives (and sometimes kicks). We also run old school post ups but the above is the basis for all of our offensive action. 

 

Vucevic isn't a good enough facilitator to replicate point guard level creation. Getting someone that can do that changes our offensive philosophy. You're going to want the ball in that guys hands which pushes vucevic more from an elbow guy to just a pick and pop guy. And if his game shifts that direction why pay vucevic, why not just grab Frank Kaminsky or Meyers Leonard to be that guy?

If you're going to build the best team around vucevic I'd replicate this current roster with a couple exceptions. You love Augustin at point because he's good off ball and is shooting 44% from 3. You want a guy who does what Evan does but better. Bogdan bogdanovic maybe. Something like that. You replace Gordon and Isaac with Robert Covington and Harrison Barnes. More reliable shooters. 

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1 hour ago, King Close said:

Someone like Jimmy Butler sure, but not Jimmy Butler. I’m a fan of his game but he’s forced his way out of every team he’s ever played for and has come close to doing it with Philly, Disney wouldn’t be the right spot for him. 

Yeah I agree

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41 minutes ago, ML6 said:

Have you all hit your heads recently? After years of unanimous agreement that Vooch needs to go, you’re now comfortable rebuilding around him? 

Last few years with no viable replacement on the roster: “TRADE HIM, GUY SUCKS. ENOUGH IS ENOUGH.”

This year after just drafting his obvious, high-ceiling replacement: “Well let’s not get too hasty here... I mean the guy has been playing pretty well.”

 

Does it not alarm some of you that even in Vooch’s “good” year, we’re still 20-28 in the weakest Eastern Conference in recent memory? What part of his Renaissance has translated to anything meaningful results-wise? 

Singing to the choir.  I would be actively pursuing trades for Vuc for sure.  Forget his play It should be done just for the dollars and cents.  If he resigns I would think it would cost us at least $20 million per year, add Mosgov's $17 million and Bamba's $6+ million and you have $43 million in the center position alone on a $109 million  team salary cap.   

 

2 minutes ago, ?4thewin said:

Vucevic gets his value from facilitating from the elbow. We dump the ball to him there. It draws centers out. Vucevic hits cutters or Gordon posting. If that's not there he runs a dribble handoff to the wing (or occasionally takes his man off the dribble). Then that evolves into a screen and roll with vucevic again. Vucevic almost always pops. If the big stays with him the ball handler drives (and sometimes kicks). We also run old school post ups but the above is the basis for all of our offensive action. 

 

Vucevic isn't a good enough facilitator to replicate point guard level creation. Getting someone that can do that changes our offensive philosophy. You're going to want the ball in that guys hands which pushes vucevic more from an elbow guy to just a pick and pop guy. And if his game shifts that direction why pay vucevic, why not just grab Frank Kaminsky or Meyers Leonard to be that guy?

If you're going to build the best team around vucevic I'd replicate this current roster with a couple exceptions. You love Augustin at point because he's good off ball and is shooting 44% from 3. You want a guy who does what Evan does but better. Bogdan bogdanovic maybe. Something like that. You replace Gordon and Isaac with Robert Covington and Harrison Barnes. More reliable shooters. 

You nailed it and gave a perfect reason why we should trade Vuc now.  What he does it not a good fit for our roster and requires what we do not have.  Seems easier to me to trade Vuc when he has value rather than trade our youth who cost us less money.   If we get rid of Isaac and Grodon and gamble on Vuc and it fails it will take forever to recover.   I would rather bet on our young guys getting better than betting on Vuc

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58 minutes ago, ML6 said:

Have you all hit your heads recently? After years of unanimous agreement that Vooch needs to go, you’re now comfortable rebuilding around him? 

Last few years with no viable replacement on the roster: “TRADE HIM, GUY SUCKS. ENOUGH IS ENOUGH.”

This year after just drafting his obvious, high-ceiling replacement: “Well let’s not get too hasty here... I mean the guy has been playing pretty well.”

 

Does it not alarm some of you that even in Vooch’s “good” year, we’re still 20-28 in the weakest Eastern Conference in recent memory? What part of his Renaissance has translated to anything meaningful results-wise? 

On one hand, I'm so happy for Vooch getting the credit he finally deserves after years of doing essentially what he's doing now but at a higher level. Now on the other hand, I don't believe he should be a focal point to build around on. WeHam have spent two drafts so far assembling a team they would like to see moving forward and have made it clear that they do not want to get rid of Isaac or Gordon. Bamba is a work in progress and we all knew that going in. Sure, I would have loved for him to take the starting role from Vooch by out playing him but he obviously needs more time due to being a raw talent and not to mention he was drafted to be the successor at the position. I don't believe we have intentions on keeping Vooch even after this level of play, so shopping him would be in our best interests.

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