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Fultz4thewin

2017-2018 Official Season Discussion Thread

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8 minutes ago, Justin Jaudon said:

God forbid we give Skiles credit for anything...

 

Skiles was absolutely right that Payton was not going to make the team better in the timeline he was working on. We were in playoff push mode, and Payton was not getting better at defense, which was killing us when we also had a poor defensive Center. A year and a half later, Skiles is proven right when we trade Payton basically because he isn't improving defensively, and you argue that because you think he deserved the chance to work out his issues that Skiles was still somehow wrong? Could it be that Skiles just knew more about Payton's game and mentality than you?

 

We don't have to like Skiles. I don't like him. But seriously, we can give him SOME credit for seeing who Payton was and pushing management to move on.

He was. I'll give him that.

The Harris trade and how he left though...

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16 minutes ago, Justin Jaudon said:

God forbid we give Skiles credit for anything...

 

Skiles was absolutely right that Payton was not going to make the team better in the timeline he was working on. We were in playoff push mode, and Payton was not getting better at defense, which was killing us when we also had a poor defensive Center. A year and a half later, Skiles is proven right when we trade Payton basically because he isn't improving defensively, and you argue that because you think he deserved the chance to work out his issues that Skiles was still somehow wrong? Could it be that Skiles just knew more about Payton's game and mentality than you?

 

We don't have to like Skiles. I don't like him. But seriously, we can give him SOME credit for seeing who Payton was and pushing management to move on.

It wasn't right to give up on Payton 2 months into his second year.  No.  

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Just now, ?4thewin said:

It wasn't right to give up on Payton 2 months into his second year.  No.  

The Skiles thing scarred Payton. Payton sucks because of Skiles. Payton is a Millennial snowflake. Millennials require tender love and affection, and Skiles gave none of it. In fact, the reason we suck so much is because of what Skiles did to the team. He sucked the life out of this team. In truth, we can blame Skiles for Nick Anderson missing those free throws against Houston in 1995. Nick was living under Skiles’ shadow and the pressure was too much.

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16 minutes ago, Catalina Maria said:

The Skiles thing scarred Payton. Payton sucks because of Skiles. Payton is a Millennial snowflake. Millennials require tender love and affection, and Skiles gave none of it. In fact, the reason we suck so much is because of what Skiles did to the team. He sucked the life out of this team. In truth, we can blame Skiles for Nick Anderson missing those free throws against Houston in 1995. Nick was living under Skiles’ shadow and the pressure was too much.

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49 minutes ago, Catalina Maria said:

The Skiles thing scarred Payton. Payton sucks because of Skiles. Payton is a Millennial snowflake. Millennials require tender love and affection, and Skiles gave none of it. In fact, the reason we suck so much is because of what Skiles did to the team. He sucked the life out of this team. In truth, we can blame Skiles for Nick Anderson missing those free throws against Houston in 1995. Nick was living under Skiles’ shadow and the pressure was too much.

Few coaches in the Skiles mold will have success dealing with the current nba player. Pop and Stan get away with it because they’ve won title(s). Dwight hated Stan cause he was a baby and needed to have his ego stroked constantly.

Most nba coaches are “player” coaches now. The days of a superstar basketball player wanting to have a coach ride his a$$ to make him better (i.e. Tim Duncan) are far behind us. 

I’m not sure Payton was that way I just think he wasn’t very good and Skiles knew that early on. 

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1 hour ago, Magicman28 said:

Great speech man but sounds too storytelling to me. Like **** just drops out of the sky. I know nothing about that. Nothing about that at all. 

You have to position yourself in the draft. We're too afraid to do that.

Simmons was a nicw pickup. He's a 6th man. We need a star. You aren't going to get one the same way you got a 6th man and trade deadline? Please. What? Fournier is going to be worth more then? Vuch? Did you see what happened to Monroe? That'll be what happened to Vuch.

Magicman is wise.  Positioning ourselves in teh draft is key for this year.  I prefer one of the first 3 picks but would take anything in the top 7.  Add one of Ayton, Doncic, Bagley, Trae Young (my preference), Jarren jackson, Bamba, and maybe Porter (if his injury is not too serious) to Gordon and Isaac (and, yes he will be a good player for us) and we have a nucleus for the future.  if our first pick is lower than that roll the dice and will [probably fail, those first 7 are solid.  Next trade one or both of the 2nd round picks we have plus a starter (Fournier if we get young, Vucevic if we get a center) to get a mid 1st round pick (Sixer's--most likely, Sun's, and Clippers have two first rounders with the 2nd of them in mid first round range) If we can get Keita Bates-Diop,  (he can shoot, silky smooth shot, can already shoot 3's defend (has a big wing span), and rebound.  6'7" 235 pounds, NBA ready and could play SF or SG.  My dream would be Trae Yound and Bates-Diop.  (49 points/game average in college).  Then it may take 2 years but that nucleus would put us in the playoffs every year, IMO!,  So do not blow a good draft pick again this year!!!

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27 minutes ago, Originalticketholder said:

Magicman is wise.  Positioning ourselves in teh draft is key for this year.  I prefer one of the first 3 picks but would take anything in the top 7.  Add one of Ayton, Doncic, Bagley, Trae Young (my preference), Jarren jackson, Bamba, and maybe Porter (if his injury is not too serious) to Gordon and Isaac (and, yes he will be a good player for us) and we have a nucleus for the future.  if our first pick is lower than that roll the dice and will [probably fail, those first 7 are solid.  Next trade one or both of the 2nd round picks we have plus a starter (Fournier if we get young, Vucevic if we get a center) to get a mid 1st round pick (Sixer's--most likely, Sun's, and Clippers have two first rounders with the 2nd of them in mid first round range) If we can get Keita Bates-Diop,  (he can shoot, silky smooth shot, can already shoot 3's defend (has a big wing span), and rebound.  6'7" 235 pounds, NBA ready and could play SF or SG.  My dream would be Trae Yound and Bates-Diop.  (49 points/game average in college).  Then it may take 2 years but that nucleus would put us in the playoffs every year, IMO!,  So do not blow a good draft pick again this year!!!

Would love KBD In the second or possibly trading back into late first for him. Has a complete offensive game, good size and length for the position, and is a really strong defender.  

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3 hours ago, fan for too long 2 said:

Yea skiles was so right about Tobias. Jennings and ilyasova are balling. You funny

Yep. Skiles was right that Gordon was better than Tobias. Tobias needed to be traded, as he and Gordon weren't working on the floor together. Pretty sure it was Rob Hennigan who was the GM who got nothing for him. We can all cry conspiracy that Skiles 'wanted his guys and forced a trade', but I really doubt Skiles demanded this specific trade. (also, Ilyasova has been really solid since we traded him; he's not Tobias, but he's not making $17 million a year, either)

 

The Tobias trade was a win-now move, trying to get players in needed positions with some familiarity who could help right away. Jennings was a borderline All-Star before the injury, and we took a chance that he had recovered. If he had, we would have had a PG who wasn't garbage on D, and who didn't wilt at the end of games. He didn't recover. It's a shame, but really - and I can't stress this enough - the only problem with the trade was Hennigan not getting a pick or a prospect thrown in. By all accounts, he didn't even ask.

 

Not that any of that is relevant to what I was saying. Skiles was right that Elfrid Payton was not going to improve in the areas we needed him to, at least not fast enough for the team to make the playoffs the next season or the next, which was what management wanted (see the subsequent spending spree). I never implied Skiles was right about everything. I only lamented that PFTW was refusing to give Skiles credit for wanting to upgrade the position years ago.

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