2017-2018 Official Season Discussion Thread

[Magicman28 295]

4 minutes ago, Payton4thewin said:

Vuc played great to start the season

Then sucked for pretty much November

Now he's playing great in December but team circumstances are weird right now

I don't trust this.  Been burned too many times before 

I wonder if he's  better without Fournier. He seems to move the ball more.

I wonder if the team itself is better without Fournier.

[ML6 520]

1 minute ago, Magicman28 said:

I wonder if he's  better without Fournier. He seems to move the ball more.

I wonder if the team itself is better without Fournier.

I think the team is just better without them together.  Fournier is the better individual player so I'd vote to keep him of the two.

We have played exactly 0 seasons where we even sniffed a winning record while Vooch has been here.  He doesn't impact winning to any degree, clearly.  We should ship him out when a suitable offer presents itself.

[ML6 520]

Also, Fournier's weaknesses are less detrimental to team success than Vooch's are.  The inability to protect the rim or defend a pick and roll to any degree just totally destroys the defense. 

[Magicman28 295]

5 minutes ago, ML6 said:

Also, Fournier's weaknesses are less detrimental to team success than Vooch's are.  The inability to protect the rim or defend a pick and roll to any degree just totally destroys the defense. 

Yeah but Fournier is no defensive force either plus he's a black hole at times. At least Vuch passes. He's also playing better defense recently and doesn't have some personal competition against teammates scoring more points.

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

37 minutes ago, Magicman28 said:

I wonder if he's  better without Fournier. He seems to move the ball more.

I wonder if the team itself is better without Fournier.

Vucevic is better without Fournier and Gordon because we basically have no choice but to run the entire offense through him.  

[Magicfan1987 266]

4 minutes ago, Payton4thewin said:

Vucevic is better without Fournier and Gordon because we basically have no choice but to run the entire offense through him.  

Great point

[Magicman28 295]

21 minutes ago, Payton4thewin said:

Vucevic is better without Fournier and Gordon because we basically have no choice but to run the entire offense through him.  

What about Vuch and Gordon minus Fournier or isn't there a big enough of a sample size to determine?

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

7 minutes ago, Magicman28 said:

What about Vuch and Gordon minus Fournier or isn't there a big enough of a sample size to determine?

I don't think it's a personnel thing.  I think if you stuck Chris paul on the team it'd impact vucevic negatively.  Its a philosophical thing. Vucevic is limited to post ups and pick and pops when there's a high usage wing out there.  Now he's being forced to make plays for others and he's doing well.  But understand what that means for our long term success.  

[jmmagicfan 301]

The one consistent thing I have seen this season is that this team plays better when they play fast. When we get past mid-court in 2-4 seconds, guys seem to already be setting screens, cutting, and playing faster/with urgency. That just doesn't happen when we take 5-6 seconds bringing it across half-court. If our point-guard is playing with energy, and initiating the offense with energy, everyone is already moving and continues moving; if we meander up the court, everyone seems to relax and cease moving. This was the big difference when Payton was out, and his one really good game was when he first came back, because that game he played in "attack mode". I just don't get it, Payton seems content to walk the ball up most of the time. Is this him, or is this the coaching? Either way, something has to change.   

[Magicman28 295]

33 minutes ago, Payton4thewin said:

I don't think it's a personnel thing.  I think if you stuck Chris paul on the team it'd impact vucevic negatively.  Its a philosophical thing. Vucevic is limited to post ups and pick and pops when there's a high usage wing out there.  Now he's being forced to make plays for others and he's doing well.  But understand what that means for our long term success.  

Limits Gordon, JI, and everyone else to role player status who went want to be more than a role player while his role is like a franchise player. No bueno.

[jec 427]

1 hour ago, ML6 said:

I think the team is just better without them together.  Fournier is the better individual player so I'd vote to keep him of the two.

We have played exactly 0 seasons where we even sniffed a winning record while Vooch has been here.  He doesn't impact winning to any degree, clearly.  We should ship him out when a suitable offer presents itself.

That's pretty crappy logic. But yeah he needs to go.

[ML6 520]

33 minutes ago, jec said:

That's pretty crappy logic. But yeah he needs to go.

I mean, the goal during some of those seasons was to lose — so you’re right, I shouldn’t hold those against him. 

My point is that it’s fairly evident that Vooch likely can’t be the starting center of a contending team today.