2017-2018 Official Season Discussion Thread

[Catalina Maria 64]

It will be interesting to see how this team looks without Payton but with a better 3 point shooting PG. Vogel said in an interview that Payton gets us going at an increased pace thereby leading to a “quick start,” but that Augustin organizes the offense better. He framed it as if both are good things. 

[Wilbur 48]

That might be a problem down the road in the playoffs (Mora: Playoffs!  You're talkin' about Playoffs!), but when you are running the chance that the ball is going to make it all the way around to Payton again on a consistent enough basis to impact this team's ceiling is not a valid concern in my mind.  I'm generally an optimist by nature, but I don't think these first three games have told us the true tale of this team yet.  Gordon and Payton have both missed time and Vuc is playing out of his mind and can not keep this up.  We may be better, we may be worse.  But FINALLY there is a product that is fun to watch.   

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

3 minutes ago, Catalina Maria said:

It will be interesting to see how this team looks without Payton but with a better 3 point shooting PG. Vogel said in an interview that Payton gets us going at an increased pace thereby leading to a “quick start,” but that Augustin organizes the offense better. He framed it as if both are good things. 

I still think we're better with payton. Just that its hard to find an upgrade at C while Vuc is playing like prime Dirk or some sort of slower kevin Durant, PF or SF as Gordon/Isaac are a big point of our identity, SG as the position as a whole has like 6 substantially different players (butler, harden, McCollum, Beal, Derozan, Thompson?) and Fournier/Ross/Simmons all belong in that second or third tier.

So you're kind of left with PG.

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

7 minutes ago, Wilbur said:

That might be a problem down the road in the playoffs (Mora: Playoffs!  You're talkin' about Playoffs!), but when you are running the chance that the ball is going to make it all the way around to Payton again on a consistent enough basis to impact this team's ceiling is not a valid concern in my mind.  I'm generally an optimist by nature, but I don't think these first three games have told us the true tale of this team yet.  Gordon and Payton have both missed time and Vuc is playing out of his mind and can not keep this up.  We may be better, we may be worse.  But FINALLY there is a product that is fun to watch.   

If Bledsoe didn't publicly ask for a trade we wouldn't even be talking about this. Payton has been solid (when healthy). we've played great. This is a conversation for mid January that we're forced to talk about now because there's a limited number of possible point guard upgrades available between now and 2019 and we're 8 months away from having to give Payton a bunch of money so when one of those possible point guard upgrades becomes available you have to talk about it.

[TheNameIsOrlando 310]

11 hours ago, DirtDan2012 said:

Someone earlier asked me.... When was the last time a passing PG won a ship..... WELL.....   In today's new league... You win by actually sharing the basketball.... San Antonio figured that one out 12 years ago. Ball movement is going to determine if you win or lose on a nightly basis anymore.  Everyone's mimicking GS....

That was me. You don't have to be a facilitator to play within the scheme of your team. Ball movement isn't assist it's passing the ball to get in better position to score. If a player has the ability to get in that position himself while also being a decent passer he's probably gonna be alright. 

[Magicman28 295]

8 hours ago, Notguilty said:

Y’all are missing the main, major point here - Bledsoe could never, never match ep’s hair! Game over!!!

Game!

End of discussion!

Seriously, I just don't think it's the right player at the right time.

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

anybody else realize that Andre Drummond has improved his FT% by 45% this year?

[Odin 137]

8 minutes ago, Payton4thewin said:

anybody else realize that Andre Drummond has improved his FT% by 45% this year?

Small sample size?

Biyombo currently is about 32% higher than last year.

DeAndre Jordan is 52% higher than last year.

Gobert (Not as bad as the others, but still in the 60% range previously) is 45% higher than last year.

(I can find more examples)

Not sure these early numbers are really anything to talk about right now, besides to say that a number of big men who struggled at the line last year are doing better so far this year.

[A Better DJ & Photographer 455]

2 hours ago, Catalina Maria said:

It will be interesting to see how this team looks without Payton but with a better 3 point shooting PG. Vogel said in an interview that Payton gets us going at an increased pace thereby leading to a “quick start,” but that Augustin organizes the offense better. He framed it as if both are good things. 

If we could get Bled for Mario, DJ, and a protected pick you have to make that move. Payton off the bench would be excellent and we could split the minutes 50/50. There are extremely limited opportunities to upgrade at PG and even with Bled's knee issues the extra scoring is worth the chance. If Bled goes down we move EP back to starter and either suck it up with Mack or run Fournier at the point. I say make the offer!

One thing I don't want to do is find ourselves in a position where we have to pay the kind of bucks to Payton that a PG that CAN shoot should be paid.

[Odin 137]

So, does anyone else think we really screwed up with Oladipo and Harris? I am not saying that we shouldn't have traded them, but our return on investment was terrible and this young season is proving it so far.

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

1 minute ago, Odin said:

So, does anyone else think we really screwed up with Oladipo and Harris? I am not saying that we shouldn't have traded them, but our return on investment was terrible and this young season is proving it so far.

I mean we definitely should have gotten more but then you see what good players are going for and I don't know. I think Oladipo and Sabonis for Ibaka is good value in a vacuum (i.e. a big man who can hit near 40% of his threes, make weakside blocks, 14 ppg) but I don't know if Ibaka really wanted to be here. and we also really botched the execution of that signing playing him in biyombo-gordon lineups and such. You have to figure the change in morale from last year to this year has something to do with Ibaka leaving.

Harris was the big screw up. We should have shopped him more. But I'm ok not having him on the team. And I wouldn't worry too much about his play so far this year. he overperforms every October and then slowly trends downhill until he craps out in January.

 

[Wilbur 48]

The fact that Paul George is in OKC for Magic assets is all you need to know about that Oladipo trade being a problem.  It was a panic move by a GM that was pretty solid on the majority of his deals.  The two biggest problems I had with Henny are (1) he did not handle the restricted FA stuff well at all.  Harris should have been flipped for future assets (picks and young players) before he hit RFA.  Instead, Henny gambled and lost on a contract and then had to give him away to clear salary and minutes.  I think he did the same thing with Fournier. 2) HE never got the right coach.  I'm a huge Oladipo fan.  I think Skiles retarded his development by plugging him in as the 6th man.