2017 NBA Draft Thread

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

Kawhi Leonard?

 

I know he could be the exception to the rule, and he was picked lower, but look at his college stats and tell me that doesn't look like Isaac's.

 

Kawhi was the number one option on his team. He averaged almost 16 and 11.

[Magicman28 295]

I find it hard to believe more people haven't thought this out.

 

What's the track record for guys getting "lost" on a college team and then flourishing in the NBA? I wouldn't think there have been many.

 

 

I don't know but I can come up with a lot of guys who flourished in college and did nothing in the NBA.

 

 

Go look at Marcus Fizer's last year in college. Then go look how long he lasted in the NBA and his career averages.

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

I don't know but I can come up with a lot of guys who flourished in college and did nothing in the NBA.

 

 

Go look at Marcus Fizer's last year in college. Then go look how long he lasted in the NBA and his career averages.

 

this is a bad argument.

[Magicman28 295]

Kawhi was the number one option on his team. He averaged almost 16 and 11.

 

 

Wonder what Isaac would've averaged if he didn't have older players pushing him down the totem poll.

[Magicman28 295]

this is a bad argument.

 

 

And why's that? ACL? He tore that 3 years in. Tweener? Dude was 6'9 and 240-260 and built like a linebacker.

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

Wonder what Isaac would've averaged if he didn't have older players pushing him down the totem poll.

 

that's the entire argument though. he's going to have older players pushing him down the totem pole here too. He's either going to fall into line as a supplemental player on offense and a good on ball/weakside defender or he's going to completely change his mentality and rise to the occasion. And the history of similar situation players is comparable to "players outside of the #1 pick who succeed in general".

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

And why's that? ACL? He tore that 3 years in. Tweener? Dude was 6'9 and 240-260 and built like a linebacker.

 

because you're starting the argument that production has no correlation to future success which then invalidates every single post that follows it. because if college behavior has no relationship with pro behavior then we can pretty much use the fact we drafted Isaac 6th as a way to validate his pro-potential. so it's self-fulfilling.

 

Isaac is a good bet because he was drafted 6th in a good draft. He was drafted 6th because he's a good bet.

 

kinda kills the discussion.

[Magicman28 295]

that's the entire argument though. he's going to have older players pushing him down the totem pole here too. He's either going to fall into line as a supplemental player on offense and a good on ball/weakside defender or he's going to completely change his mentality and rise to the occasion. And the history of similar situation players is comparable to "players outside of the #1 pick who succeed in general".

 

 

I could see that if we're GS. New management isn't and shouldn't be handcuffed to anyone regardless of their experience and if they are, they shouldn't be employed.

 

How much do you think it's mentality vs freshman in college playing the role his coach gave him?

[Magicman28 295]

because you're starting the argument that production has no correlation to future success which then invalidates every single post that follows it. because if college behavior has no relationship with pro behavior then we can pretty much use the fact we drafted Isaac 6th as a way to validate his pro-potential. so it's self-fulfilling.

 

Isaac is a good bet because he was drafted 6th in a good draft. He was drafted 6th because he's a good bet.

 

kinda kills the discussion.

 

 

Lol@self-self fulfilling. Nah it just means I made an strong point that negates your point. Production itself is not an sole predictor of success. Skills plus hard work usually is.

 

Jimmy Butler

 

Dude didn't even have a pulse as an freshman. I think you'd take him and his production wouldn't you?

[Odin 137]

Kawhi was the number one option on his team. He averaged almost 16 and 11.

 

Hmm, ok get your argument. Was thinking more along the lines of underrated guys that were not used quite correctly in college and flourished in the league.

 

Also, not sure how well college comparisons transfer over to the NBA, but Isaac's freshman year is pretty statistically similar to Leonard's sophomore year, especially if you go to PER 40 or PER 100 possession #s and their advanced stats seem to pretty well aligned, though Isaac is a better shooter than Leonard was in college.

[Fultz4thewin 2,464]

I could see that if we're GS. New management isn't and shouldn't be handcuffed to anyone regardless of their experience and if they are, they shouldn't be employed.

 

How much do you think it's mentality vs freshman in college playing the role his coach gave him?

 

most young players suck. the top guys suck. fultz is going to suck for a year. fox is going to suck. tatum is going to suck. Jackson is going to suck (relative to expectations).

 

Isaac is going to suck initially (relative to his overall talent). Fournier and Gordon and ross and payton are all going to be massively better than him this year. and if we take a position that Isaac should earn his role he's going to be a 3-D guy for the first year at least.

 

The role he earns is going to be very comparable to the role he played in college. the danger is he's going to fall into those habits and fit in. because he did the exact same thing in college.

[Magicman28 295]

Hmm, ok get your argument. Was thinking more along the lines of underrated guys that were not used quite correctly in college and flourished in the league.

 

Also, not sure how well college comparisons transfer over to the NBA, but Isaac's freshman year is pretty statistically similar to Leonard's sophomore year, especially if you go to PER 40 or PER 100 possession #s and their advanced stats seem to pretty well aligned, though Isaac is a better shooter than Leonard was in college.

 

 

This.

 

I think we should keep the fact Isaac was a freshman when comparing production to him and the successes, mediocres, and failures of the NBA as a very important variable.