Gun control

[Secretly Space Jesus 670]

Not that you made this point, but someone else recently brought this up, and pointed to the decline in violent crime as being directly attributed to the "assault weapons ban", neglecting the fact that violent crime did not reverse course and escalate once the ban ended in 2004.

 

That's true, and I acknowledge that. At the same time, it's worth noting that 2004 was right around when the decline in violent crime rates, which had been in freefall, began to slow down. But there are a lot of other factors that need to be addressed, both in discussing the freefall and discussing why it slowed down.

 

I think the reason we'll never have any kind of meaningful public attempts to curtail gun violence in this country is because there is huge money for lobbyists on both sides to paint every individual idea in the most black and white terms possible.

 

So we don't look at individual ideas, like the assault weapons ban for example, in terms of "Is this a worthwhile individual step in a much larger, comprehensive plan to reduce gun violence?" and instead look at it as: "Would doing this and literally nothing else prevent all gun violence everywhere ever?" and when the answer is "Obviously not" we move on.

[TheREALBrooksThompson 157]

There is also a link between violent crime and atmospheric lead levels. That might be worth further study.

 

I don't much care what happens with the gun control thing. I have no intention of ever using or owning a gun. The likelihood that I'll find myself in a situation where I need a gun to save my life is small enough to be put into the category of things that I really don't need to waste time worrying about. I'm not going to live my life in constant fear, always looking over my shoulder with my hand on a gun, waiting for something to happen so I can start shooting and save the day. That scenario is extremely unlikely to come up in the first place, and even if it did my likelihood of shooting the right guy and saving the day is similarly small. So I don't want a gun, I don't want to use a gun, and I don't want guns around me.

 

I share DOM's opinion that there is too much money to be made to really get any kind of gun restrictions passed. Corporate lobbyists are in charge of pretty much everything in our government.

[For the love of the game 56]

There is also a link between violent crime and atmospheric lead levels. That might be worth further study.

 

I don't much care what happens with the gun control thing. I have no intention of ever using or owning a gun. The likelihood that I'll find myself in a situation where I need a gun to save my life is small enough to be put into the category of things that I really don't need to waste time worrying about. I'm not going to live my life in constant fear, always looking over my shoulder with my hand on a gun, waiting for something to happen so I can start shooting and save the day. That scenario is extremely unlikely to come up in the first place, and even if it did my likelihood of shooting the right guy and saving the day is similarly small. So I don't want a gun, I don't want to use a gun, and I don't want guns around me.

 

I share DOM's opinion that there is too much money to be made to really get any kind of gun restrictions passed. Corporate lobbyists are in charge of pretty much everything in our government.

 

I understand where you are coming from and your points are valid. I was actually of the same perspective in regards to owning a gun until recently as I stated above (but did know how to use one and shot a lot) There is little chance I will ever have to us mine to protect my family and myself, but in the event I do, I like the idea of at least having a fighting chance.

 

I do bet that you take certain steps other than owning a gun to protect yourself though. Not walking down dark allies, not flashing cash, etc. I am sure you lock all the doors to your home at night and are observent of your surroundings in general. Owning a gun is just the next step in protection.

[TheREALBrooksThompson 157]

I understand where you are coming from and your points are valid. I was actually of the same perspective in regards to owning a gun until recently as I stated above (but did know how to use one and shot a lot) There is little chance I will ever have to us mine to protect my family and myself, but in the event I do, I like the idea of at least having a fighting chance.

 

I do bet that you take certain steps other than owning a gun to protect yourself though. Not walking down dark allies, not flashing cash, etc. I am sure you lock all the doors to your home at night and are observent of your surroundings in general. Owning a gun is just the next step in protection.

 

I don't carry around lots of cash, but that's more a product of the convenience of cards than anything else. There isn't a need to carry more than a couple of 20s in most situations, so I don't. It's not because I'm afraid someone is going to rob me.

 

I'm generally not fearful of walking around in bad parts of town or whatever. I grew up in one. I do lock doors and things like that, but that's more to make me feel better. If people really want to steal my things they're going to break in and there isn't a whole lot I can do about it. Fortunately, that's also a rare occurrence.

 

But even if all those things were actually things that I need to constantly worry about, getting a gun isn't going to improve any of them. I could end up Zimmermaning someone, and I'd feel far worse about that than I would about something bad happening to me and not being able to stop it.

 

Bad things are going to happen sometimes, but I'd rather live my life the way I want to and be happy with that instead of stress myself out with constant fear thinking I'm going to prevent all these things from happening. I'm not going to prevent them.

 

I understand guns make some people feel safer. It's just not for me.

[Captain Hi-Top 791]

Bad things are going to happen sometimes, but I'd rather live my life the way I want to and be happy with that instead of stress myself out with constant fear thinking I'm going to prevent all these things from happening. I'm not going to prevent them.

 

I understand guns make some people feel safer. It's just not for me.

 

I have a concealed weapons permit. My firearm is not a safety net. It's not something I cling to in order to feel safe. I enjoy shooting at the range, testing and improving my marksmanship skills developed in the Marines. It's a tool, and nothing more. As a matter of fact, I almost never carry it on my person. It generally stays on my dresser overnight, and in my car during the day. I do carry it in my tactical messenger bag when I spend time hiking in the woods.

 

I look at it as a tool, one that is better to have and not need than need and not have.

 

Taking that into account, I am very much in favor of certain gun control laws and ideas being passed around, especially concerning background checks. I think every firearm should be registered, and every purchase should require a thorough background check as well as a transfer of said license.

 

I am not in favor of banning "large capacity" magazines and "assault" weapons.

[For the love of the game 56]

I don't carry around lots of cash, but that's more a product of the convenience of cards than anything else. There isn't a need to carry more than a couple of 20s in most situations, so I don't. It's not because I'm afraid someone is going to rob me.

 

I'm generally not fearful of walking around in bad parts of town or whatever. I grew up in one. I do lock doors and things like that, but that's more to make me feel better. If people really want to steal my things they're going to break in and there isn't a whole lot I can do about it. Fortunately, that's also a rare occurrence.

 

But even if all those things were actually things that I need to constantly worry about, getting a gun isn't going to improve any of them. I could end up Zimmermaning someone, and I'd feel far worse about that than I would about something bad happening to me and not being able to stop it.

 

Bad things are going to happen sometimes, but I'd rather live my life the way I want to and be happy with that instead of stress myself out with constant fear thinking I'm going to prevent all these things from happening. I'm not going to prevent them.

 

I understand guns make some people feel safer. It's just not for me.

 

By flashing I meant making it known you have a lot of cash on you, not that you dont carry a lot of cash. I am sure you have seen the stupid guy at the mall with a cute girl on his side making it more than obvious he is loaded with cash. All the while Mr slime ball shady character notices it just like you did and following him out to the parking lot....

 

Regarding the bad side of town comment, I grew up in one also. Thankfully, I am not there now. If I was, thus having no choice in the matter, I would prob me more mindful of my surroundings than fearful. I lock my doors for that added bit of protection for my family not my stuff. If someone whats my stuff fine, it can be replaced. However they better not pose a risk to my family while trying to take my stuff.

 

Zimmerman was a fool for following him, as the rest of the details arent clear, I will leave that alone.

 

I do live my life as I want, not fearful or stressed out that something bad is going to happen to me. Without getting too religious, my life is in Gods hands. However, since there is not a gun carrying angel at my call to protect my family and I in the rare event that danger come up, I choose to get a CWP

[TheREALBrooksThompson 157]

I don't think there's much of a threat of people just going around indiscriminately killing people. If someone is breaking into your house they're almost certainly there for money and items that they can turn into money.

 

In that situation, my priority is going to be to get the hell out of there. What I don't want to do is confront the burglars and risk further harm to my person, or risk accidentally bringing harm to a family member or something.

 

I actually had something like this happen when I was 4 or 5. A guy had broken into my dad's car during the night, and we found him asleep in the drivers seat holding a gun and the car's stereo in the morning. My dad immediately got my brother and I and ran with us to a neighbor's house to call the police. No one was harmed, not even the burglar, who it turned out just had a drug problem and needed help, not to be executed.

 

Obviously that's not representative of all situations, but I think it did inform my preference to remove myself from dangerous situations rather than try to control them. Lots of things can go wrong in those situations regardless of intent.

 

It's just a different perspective. I don't have a problem with people having guns for whatever reason. I just take a different approach.

[For the love of the game 56]

I don't think there's much of a threat of people just going around indiscriminately killing people. If someone is breaking into your house they're almost certainly there for money and items that they can turn into money.

 

In that situation, my priority is going to be to get the hell out of there. What I don't want to do is confront the burglars and risk further harm to my person, or risk accidentally bringing harm to a family member or something.

 

I actually had something like this happen when I was 4 or 5. A guy had broken into my dad's car during the night, and we found him asleep in the drivers seat holding a gun and the car's stereo in the morning. My dad immediately got my brother and I and ran with us to a neighbor's house to call the police. No one was harmed, not even the burglar, who it turned out just had a drug problem and needed help, not to be executed.

 

Obviously that's not representative of all situations, but I think it did inform my preference to remove myself from dangerous situations rather than try to control them. Lots of things can go wrong in those situations regardless of intent.

 

It's just a different perspective. I don't have a problem with people having guns for whatever reason. I just take a different approach.

 

Much threat no, but there is obviously a threat non the less. Captain said it good in that its a tool better to have an not need than need and not have. Ever try to get your wife out of a window and hand over your 6 year old at two A.M after hearing a window break in your living room (I have not either as this is just a what if) Fine that you would try to get the hell out of there, but it would not work for me. Add my coming addition to my family and it would be just about impossible. No, in that situation, I would rather take my chance at killing the bad guy than get cought with my butt sticking out of a window.

 

You example is interesting. Obviously a drug addict passed out in your dads car does not need to be executed. But had he woken up while you and your brother were near the car and pointed the gun at you, what could have happened next might not have turned out so good.

 

I like captains ideas in his last post.

[TheREALBrooksThompson 157]

Much threat no, but there is obviously a threat non the less. Captain said it good in that its a tool better to have an not need than need and not have. Ever try to get your wife out of a window and hand over your 6 year old at two A.M after hearing a window break in your living room (I have not either as this is just a what if) Fine that you would try to get the hell out of there, but it would not work for me. Add my coming addition to my family and it would be just about impossible. No, in that situation, I would rather take my chance at killing the bad guy than get cought with my butt sticking out of a window.

 

You example is interesting. Obviously a drug addict passed out in your dads car does not need to be executed. But had he woken up while you and your brother were near the car and pointed the gun at you, what could have happened next might not have turned out so good.

 

I like captains ideas in his last post.

 

It may have also turned out much worse for everyone if my dad had confronted the guy with his own gun. Maybe the guy wakes up and starts shooting. Who knows.

 

I feel more comfortable not even taking that chance.

 

Another thing to think about in terms of a mass shooting in a public place:

 

Let's say you're out at a mall or something and some nutjob starts shooting people. You take him out with your gun. Do you trust that everyone else in that situation will recognize that you're the good guy? Or are they going to hear a bunch of shots and look over and see you standing there with a gun surrounded by a bunch of people who have been shot? What if one of them has a gun?

 

What if you're that other guy with a gun who looks over and mistakes the good guy for the nutjob?

 

That's a ton of important decisions that are going to be made very quickly under extreme stress. I don't trust myself or my fellow citizen to make those decisions.

 

Again, do what you want. I'm not advocating banning guns. But it's worth considering how easily mistakes can be made, and with a gun a mistake is not just a trivial error that can be excused.

[For the love of the game 56]

It may have also turned out much worse for everyone if my dad had confronted the guy with his own gun. Maybe the guy wakes up and starts shooting. Who knows.

 

I feel more comfortable not even taking that chance.

 

Another thing to think about in terms of a mass shooting in a public place:

 

Let's say you're out at a mall or something and some nutjob starts shooting people. You take him out with your gun. Do you trust that everyone else in that situation will recognize that you're the good guy? Or are they going to hear a bunch of shots and look over and see you standing there with a gun surrounded by a bunch of people who have been shot? What if one of them has a gun?

 

What if you're that other guy with a gun who looks over and mistakes the good guy for the nutjob?

 

That's a ton of important decisions that are going to be made very quickly under extreme stress. I don't trust myself or my fellow citizen to make those decisions.

 

Again, do what you want. I'm not advocating banning guns. But it's worth considering how easily mistakes can be made, and with a gun a mistake is not just a trivial error that can be excused.

 

You have posed a very real possibility. One that I have thought of and really do not have a good answer for. I do not know how I would react in that situation. I do not know if the best action is to just run away and pray I do not get hit or try and confront the situation. I know that I would personally rather have a gun that I might not use that be cought empty handed. What I am not going to say is that I would rather save one life and be taken down in error by another good guy, because that is not me. I want to live an be my kids hero rather than a bunch of strangers.

 

Just because a person is carrying does not mean he has to us it in that situation.

 

Just as you are not advocating banning guns, I am not advocating everyone carry. Its a personal decision that I am making for the sole purpose of protection of my family and myself primarly. That is not to say that I would not react to help another if the situation arose and the shot presented itself.

[DanA_TBDP 12]

If you break into my home with the intention of stealing my property, your life has lost all value to me and I'd rather see you in a morgue than a jail cell.

[TheREALBrooksThompson 157]

If you break into my home with the intention of stealing my property, your life has lost all value to me and I'd rather see you in a morgue than a jail cell.

 

That's an impressively tough stance on crime.

 

Would you support legislation that makes breaking and entering a capital offense that automatically negates the right to due process?