MVP Race

[Perciville Jones 26]

Well not great offense compared to other teams but I like their offense.

[Secretly Space Jesus 670]

If Dwight averaged over 22

 

 

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He's averaging over 23.

 

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[Secretly Space Jesus 670]

Well not great offense compared to other teams but I like their offense.

 

 

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What you like is irrelevant, pathetic man-animal.

 

If you liked it when a team did nothing but shoot half court shots, it would still be incredibly stupid for them to do so, since such a strategem is inefficient.

 

Indeed, only a puny Teegeeackian would confuse an offensive aesthetics with its effectiveness.

 

Ha-ha!

 

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[Sabian Jackson 0]

Nice to see a lot of people getting involved in the discussion, and a lot of people voting in the poll. Slightly surprised to see Kobe get a vote. I'd be interested to hear the reasons for that.

 

Back to the Rose discussion, take this how you want, but nba.com is reporting that only 4 players have hit more than 3 shots in the last 30 seconds of the game in tight games, and one of them is Rose. (Others being Westbrook, Dirk and Gay)

I realise he isn't "that" efficient, but compared to the two times MVP Lebron, he is miles better. (Lebron has made 1)

 

Now, I see a lot of positives for Dwight on here, and I see most of your points, but my question to you is this:

 

Would you really want to give the ball to Dwight instead of Rose if you had those two options and the game was on the line?

 

I'd struggle to believe someone arguing against Rose being a much better option here.

[BMP 424]

Nice to see a lot of people getting involved in the discussion, and a lot of people voting in the poll. Slightly surprised to see Kobe get a vote. I'd be interested to hear the reasons for that.

 

Back to the Rose discussion, take this how you want, but nba.com is reporting that only 4 players have hit more than 3 shots in the last 30 seconds of the game in tight games, and one of them is Rose. (Others being Westbrook, Dirk and Gay)

I realise he isn't "that" efficient, but compared to the two times MVP Lebron, he is miles better. (Lebron has made 1)

 

Now, I see a lot of positives for Dwight on here, and I see most of your points, but my question to you is this:

 

Would you really want to give the ball to Dwight instead of Rose if you had those two options and the game was on the line?

 

I'd struggle to believe someone arguing against Rose being a much better option here.

 

 

It depends on who's guarding Dwight and who's guarding Rose, but Dwight would get the vote more than Rose.

 

And it's no wonder Rose has made more than 3 shots in those situations. He has the ball every single time down the court and in tight games will sometimes be the only one that gets to touch the ball. How often does Dwight get passed the ball in those situations? Almost never. While it may be because of his free throw shooting, it's still a minor aspect of the game and still a better basketball decision (again, Howard with the ball in a close game is better than most players shooting 40% because Howard will at LEAST get fouled and get you 1 point).

 

 

Rose getting the MVP from Howard would be a lot like Shaq being robbed of one in 2001 and Allen Iverson getting it, which is only fitting because Rose is a poor man's Iverson and Howard is a poor man's Shaq (at least late 90s/early 2000s Shaq).

[Sabian Jackson 0]

It depends on who's guarding Dwight and who's guarding Rose, but Dwight would get the vote more than Rose.

 

And it's no wonder Rose has made more than 3 shots in those situations. He has the ball every single time down the court and in tight games will sometimes be the only one that gets to touch the ball. How often does Dwight get passed the ball in those situations? Almost never. While it may be because of his free throw shooting, it's still a minor aspect of the game and still a better basketball decision (again, Howard with the ball in a close game is better than most players shooting 40% because Howard will at LEAST get fouled and get you 1 point).

 

 

Rose getting the MVP from Howard would be a lot like Shaq being robbed of one in 2001 and Allen Iverson getting it, which is only fitting because Rose is a poor man's Iverson and Howard is a poor man's Shaq (at least late 90s/early 2000s Shaq).

 

 

I think from this we can draw the conclusion that is it definitely only a two man race.

 

For me though, I'd give it to Rose every single time. He is one of the best drive and finish players in the league, and he shoots a very high percentage at the free throw line (nearly 85%).

 

I guess there is a huge problem comparing the two since they are essentially polar opposites. Rose is offensively minded, Dwight is defensively minded. Dwight excels where Rose doesn't, and vice versa, along with the obvious size and playing style differences.

 

Perhaps what is needed is a clear definition of what criteria makes someone an MVP.

[BMP 424]

I think from this we can draw the conclusion that is it definitely only a two man race.

 

For me though, I'd give it to Rose every single time. He is one of the best drive and finish players in the league, and he shoots a very high percentage at the free throw line (nearly 85%).

 

I guess there is a huge problem comparing the two since they are essentially polar opposites. Rose is offensively minded, Dwight is defensively minded. Dwight excels where Rose doesn't, and vice versa, along with the obvious size and playing style differences.

 

Perhaps what is needed is a clear definition of what criteria makes someone an MVP.

 

Dwight's a better scorer than Rose so I wouldn't say Rose excels where Dwight doesn't (unless you're talking about passing, but that'd be like me saying Rose isn't as good of a shot blocker)

 

 

oh, and I'd give the MVP to LeBron and Dirk before Rose as well. Much better players and also arguably just as important (if not more) to their team.

[Sabian Jackson 0]

Dwight's a better scorer than Rose so I wouldn't say Rose excels where Dwight doesn't (unless you're talking about passing, but that'd be like me saying Rose isn't as good of a shot blocker)

 

 

oh, and I'd give the MVP to LeBron and Dirk before Rose as well. Much better players and also arguably just as important (if not more) to their team.

 

 

I thought I made that obvious when I said about Dwight being better defensively.

 

I'd say you'd have a tough time giving it to Dirk over Rose. The only stats where Dirk is better is in rebounding, and for someone whos nearly 7 foot, he should be getting more than about 2 more per game. He's also barely averaging more blocks per game than Rose, which again for a 7 footer is pretty poor.

 

Lebron doesn't deserve the MVP this year at all. Not even close. Yeah he's putting up big numbers on his team, but look at his team, and look who he plays with. They should be miles ahead in the east. He doesn't perform under pressure either. 1 for 10 or so in clutch situations? Something like that. Rose is four times better than him then. That's a big, big difference. Particularly for a back to back MVP winner.

 

Having said all this, there may be someone I've overlooked. It seems Russell Westbrook has posted pretty much the same numbers as Rose, whilst on a team with KD. Seems he is also the Thunders clutch perfomer. (50% at 4 for 8 in the last 30 seconds when the game is on the line). That is impressive. Take away his probably poor shot selection for his one 3pt shot, and it gets even better. (4 for 7). Admittedly the Bulls have a better record, so I suppose that counts for something.

 

I wonder if I can change my vote....

[BMP 424]

I thought I made that obvious when I said about Dwight being better defensively.

 

I'd say you'd have a tough time giving it to Dirk over Rose. The only stats where Dirk is better is in rebounding, and for someone whos nearly 7 foot, he should be getting more than about 2 more per game. He's also barely averaging more blocks per game than Rose, which again for a 7 footer is pretty poor.

 

Lebron doesn't deserve the MVP this year at all. Not even close. Yeah he's putting up big numbers on his team, but look at his team, and look who he plays with. They should be miles ahead in the east. He doesn't perform under pressure either. 1 for 10 or so in clutch situations? Something like that. Rose is four times better than him then. That's a big, big difference. Particularly for a back to back MVP winner.

 

Having said all this, there may be someone I've overlooked. It seems Russell Westbrook has posted pretty much the same numbers as Rose, whilst on a team with KD. Seems he is also the Thunders clutch perfomer. (50% at 4 for 8 in the last 30 seconds when the game is on the line). That is impressive. Take away his probably poor shot selection for his one 3pt shot, and it gets even better. (4 for 7). Admittedly the Bulls have a better record, so I suppose that counts for something.

 

I wonder if I can change my vote....

 

 

Dirk, LeBron, and Howard are all better scorers, LeBron a better play maker, rebounder, defender, etc, etc. Just because you think the Heat should have 0 losses, doesn't mean they're underachieving. Those players don't fit in very well and their bench is just awful. The Heat being 0-2 without LeBron also helps his case.

 

 

Clutch situations is just such a silly thing to actually base an entire year of basketball with, but if you're going to continue to try to make a huge fuss about it, try to expand it a bit more than "game winners" because if you were going to talk exclusive game winners from this year Kobe Bryant would be one of the least clutch players in the league. I think against Cleveland alone he missed around 5 shots that would've otherwise tied the game or given them the lead (in the last 2 minutes)

 

http://www.82games.c...011/CSORT11.HTM

 

 

 

Really, Rose isn't the best at anything he does (except maybe cross overs that lead to OOHS and AHHS from the crowd that leads to bricks). I can't honestly agree with giving the MVP to a guy that's not the best at anything!!! He has one of the highest usage percentages in the league and essentially involved in every single offensive play, yet his team is a below average offensive team. What does that say about Rose?

[Svanxx 30]

Since the NBA gives out their awards in almost the same fashion as the Grammy's, I really expect Rose to get it, despite the fact that he isn't even the best PG in the league and the stats show that Dwight (and several others) are better than him.

[Zara 74]

If there was something like a Fantasy Draft in the league, ie with all contracts voided, all players FAs, and GMs were given (in random turn) the chance to sign players from scratch to their franchises, would the management -in whichever city- with the no1 pick skip Dwight and sign Rose? Or anyone else?

 

Is it even a question? You pass on Dwight Howard? To get what? A good playmaker? A great SF? A skillful PF?

 

This person may even play on a team with 4 players against 6 AND IT WON'T ACTUALLY MATTER MUCH, because still it's gonna be them 6 players fouling him and sending him to the free throw line.

Just because the Association is raping the game and not treating him like those "old-time greats" doesn't mean he isn't. If we were in a sexy era for big-men, or he was with a sexy franchise even now, half of the opponents would be disqualified by the end of the first quarter and the other half would stop fouling since it is physically impossible to contain his shot without "excessive contact".

 

 

Rose needs good teammates, a great coach, a media-pumped franchise, 3 refs and half the night's possessions to, i don't know, "take over" the game.

Dwight needs an orange ball.

[Optimist Prime 197]

Rose needs good teammates, a great coach, a media-pumped franchise, 3 refs and half the night's possessions to, i don't know, "take over" the game.

Dwight needs an orange ball.

 

So THAT'S why Dwight's never won a 3-Point Shooting contest... Those Money Balls will get you.