Run/Gun Might Not Be Right

[~O~ 565]

Notice that "ALL" of the best breaking teams(Phoenix, Dallas, Golden State, Denver) have been knocked out of the playoffs?

 

These teams have been running all year and were halted by "DEFENSIVE" teams, San Antonio and Utah. On the other hand, these teams have worn themselves out on the season by continuing to play this offense for a whole....8-9 months. You have to wonder, being the best doesn't necessarily mean that you will win the finals.

 

Our primary goal for the off season should be leaning more to the defensive end possibly. I know we have stoppers in Keyon Dooling and Trevor Ariza but I think one more has to do the trick......Gerald Wallace.

 

I actually sort of think we need to rethink our offensive game quite a bit.

[~O~ 565]

Notice that "ALL" of the best breaking teams(Phoenix, Dallas, Golden State, Denver) have been knocked out of the playoffs?

 

These teams have been running all year and were halted by "DEFENSIVE" teams, San Antonio and Utah. On the other hand, these teams have worn themselves out on the season by continuing to play this offense for a whole....8-9 months. You have to wonder, being the best doesn't necessarily mean that you will win the finals.

 

Our primary goal for the off season should be leaning more to the defensive end possibly. I know we have stoppers in Keyon Dooling and Trevor Ariza but I think one more has to do the trick......Gerald Wallace.

 

I actually sort of think we need to rethink our offensive game quite a bit.

[nbr 15]

You should've contributed in the Phoenix thread, we're discussing this at the moment, get in on it, lol.

[Undisputed4 0]

That made no sense. You said all the fast break teams were eliminated by defensive teams. But Golden State eliminated Dallas.

 

And Denver wasnt really a fast break team. Only when Iverson got it in the open court. Most of the time they liked to get Carmelo on the low block.

 

 

Phoenix plays decent D. They have some good individual defenders like Raja and Kurt Thomas. Its just Tony Parker killed Nash and Tim Duncan killed everyone. Plus the Spurs were a more veteran team.

 

Phoenix runs alot but they do it with precision. They can play a half court game if necessary.

 

Dallas hasnt been a true run n gun team since Nelson left. Avery Johnson has been trying to get them to a half court team. Nash and Finley left who were the main guys when Nelson was there.

[~O~ 565]

quote:

Originally posted by Undisputed4:

That made no sense. You said all the fast break teams were eliminated by defensive teams. But Golden State eliminated Dallas.

 

And Denver wasnt really a fast break team. Only when Iverson got it in the open court. Most of the time they liked to get Carmelo on the low block.

 

 

Phoenix plays decent D. They have some good individual defenders like Raja and Kurt Thomas. Its just Tony Parker killed Nash and Tim Duncan killed everyone. Plus the Spurs were a more veteran team.

 

Phoenix runs alot but they do it with precision. They can play a half court game if necessary.

 

Dallas hasnt been a true run n gun team since Nelson left. Avery Johnson has been trying to get them to a half court team. Nash and Finley left who were the main guys when Nelson was there.

 

Are you kidding me. When Denver played us, the fast break they asses right off of our turnovers making our D look like ******. The did this with other teams to.

 

Saying that Dallas ins't run and gun when they were one of the top 5 run and gun teams is another excuse.

 

Overall, these fast breaking teams had to play each other either way so the "BEST" defense and ball handling wins of course.

 

In the Warriors vs. Mavericks case, the Warriors were more of the gunning team and younger athletic team therefore making them the victor. Warriors lead the NBA in fast break points the regular season. The Spurs being a veterean team? Ha!!!! The Suns were better overall against the whole NBA and finished second in the standings.

 

You have no clue do you, San Antonio still has the players and don't make me have to remind you of Duncan's 9 blocks in that closer vs. the suns. Bowen doesn't play either. He'll try to injure a fool.

 

As for the case of Utah, they have the overall killing defender in Andrei Kirilenko who provided some offense but mostly defense. Okur, Giricek, and Fisher are the others who simply don't mess around on D.

 

Your excusing them just like you would excuse JJ for missing a shot

 

Don't let me have to burn you again another day.

[Magicman28 295]

quote:

Originally posted by ball junkie:

The one word that I took from your post NBR that was used over and over, "TALENT"!

 

People here think coaching will solve all the problems. I'm a firm believer that we need both. Better talent and coaching.

 

It's 50-50.

 

I agree. Thats why we need to take care of this coaching thing right freaking now. Coaches imput to their GM's which player is "talented" for their style.

[nbr 15]

aaarrrggghhhh, lol.

 

Maybe I misunderstood, lol. However, without a doubt and I think you'd be inclined to do so.

 

Are you implying anything in regard to our team, lol?

[The Ghost of John Gabriel 0]

If the goal is to win a championship, why would we want to model our team after the Suns?

 

Dallas moved from the uptempto run and gun style, it resulted in a Finals appearance, and they should have won the whole thing. They fell to the same style this year, but GS got smoked the next round vs. Utah.

 

Look at the 4 teams remaining. Defensive minded, well executing half court offenses. That's what win championships & that's why Rick Carlyle is a much better candidate than Iavaroni, Billy D., or any of the other candidates being discussed.

[Knappy 0]

quote:

Originally posted by ball junkie:

quote:

Originally posted by nbr3345:

aaarrrggghhhh, lol.

 

Maybe I misunderstood, lol. However, without a doubt and I think you'd be inclined to do so.

 

Are you implying anything in regard to our team, lol?

 

 

NBR, I'll respond to your question with another question.

 

Based on the results of the teams style of play that make-up the NBA's Final Four(Utah, S.A., Detroit, Cleveland), would you rather keep the same roster and play a more up-tempo style of play, which is what Otis is suggesting for Jameer's sake, or would you rather make some changes in the roster to immulate the style of play that seems so successful this post-season? Defensive minded teams that execute well in the halfcourt.

 

Can I reply as well? I would like to see an uptempo game for the Magic - I think we have good players and I liked the way they played the end of 05 and people like Jameer then - he shot 53% from the field in 21 games averaging 22 pts. The chemistry was great - Darko and Ariza were playing and Grant Hill was out for the season. They mixed it up - Brian just let them play - reluctantly - he didn't want to and was really hesistant to play Ariza and Darko - the fans were going crazy that he wouldn't play them and finally he probably told management that I am not responsible - and they played great.

 

Especially, if we had to play under Brian Hill again - that would be a disaster and when you talk about a half court game it scares me that you are entertaining bringing the idiot back.

 

This team can run and should run - it is much harder to play a slow half court game continuosly. No one needs to go at the pace of Phoenix or GS, but you can run like Houston, Utah can run and play half court, NJ can run, San Antonio can run, Detroit can run and the top teams you refer to can play defense. Brian Hill is a horrible defensive coach - I watched the games - why do people say he is a good defensive coach - are you kidding me - he is incapable of a plan that includes covering the 3 pt. shooter.

 

Anyway, I think the Magic need to play uptempo and play more uptempo than half court, but do you need to play a half court game and be able to execute yes and you also have to play some defenese.

 

Phoenix was close to winning - and I did pick San Antonio and Detroit to get to the finals ahead of time and almost bet on each when in Vegas - both were at 6 to 1 - I didn't like Dallas at all and I thought that Phoenix would have a shot.

 

Phoenix possibly could have beat San Antonio if they won game 5 and they were screwed in that game. It could have gone either way.

[ball junkie 277]

Smack, good post except you left out one thing. Cleveland is number 5 on your defensive team list so I think I'd put them in the same category as Detroit and the Spurs for that argument for defensive minded teams. Utah being the only team that isn't which surprises me since Jerry Sloan is such an old-school hard nosed type coach.

 

I'll even take this one step further. Cavs fans wanted Mike Brown fired mid-season citing an offense that had no imagination. Sound famaliar Magic fans? Brown then changes his starting point guard to Larry Hughes and the team's play improves greatly. He's really not even a point guard although he's doing a darn good job.(lol)

 

Since everyone complains about Jameer(me included) and there doesn't seem to be an opportunity this summer to improve that position why can't we give the starting point guard job to Keyon Dooling? He certainly can't do any worse than Jammeer!?

 

I mean if Larry Hughes can be converted into a point guard why not Keyon?

[Magicman28 295]

Yall should really research Iavaroni a little more. Hes the "defensive coach" for the suns but helps D'Antoni with gameplans because he has an high IQ on x's and o's. The reason why hes an interesting candidate is because 1. He has experience as an player. 2. Hes a big man's coach. He has many years of experience working with Pete Newell who runs the big mans camp during the off season. He is responsible for helping Amare becoming a more complete offensive player. Remember, Amare was just a dunk maching when he was drafted. Hes now scoring at a high clip and really has more versatility to his game thanks to his hard work and to Iavaroni.

 

The thing about this run and gun is we're not trying to duplicate the suns. We're just not trying duplicate the Magic of 95. Dwight should not be playing like Shaq did. Hes more versatile then that and has nice form on his stroke. BHill rather him be the next Shaq. I guess to relive something that was the only positive in his career coaching career. To have Dwight to play like that, would be career suicide. This team needs a coach who can utilize his players strengths. BHill doesn't do that. He forces them to play HIS style. Jameer is not a walk the ball up player. This team is to young to walk the ball up the court every possession. BHill doesn't get that. He wants Shaq Deuce every time.

 

Iavaroni is a great candidate and since we have missed out on Adelman (the perfect candidate) if we miss out on him after this whole fiasco, then the next thing we should be talking about is getting new ownership.

 

http://www.nba.com/coachfile/marc_iavaroni/index.html?nav=page

 

This is some info on him. You can find more if you google him.

[Skywise316 211]

I'm telling you guys.. Rick Carlisle is the way to go.

 

Just because Brian Hill is classified as a half court/defensive minded coach doesn't mean he's any good at it!

 

I honestly don't care what kind of style the Magic run on either side of the court next season as long as they execute it well and is able to make adjustments when things aren't working. Whether that's quarter to quarter or during the course of a playoff series.